1,199 segments
Anybody who's listening who was alive and old enough to live through 1988 and 1989,
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first off, and who knew anything about UFOs back in 1988, 1989,
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talking about intact craft in the possession of the government was really fringe even in the UFO field.
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Talking about the US Navy, everybody was talking about the US Air Force back then.
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The conversation about the US Navy was not popular in 1989.
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Who was alive in 88 and 89? But to be around Bob when everything hit the fan,
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how to convey what it was really like, to be followed about the break-ins at his house,
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those things were really happening. It was a very tense time.
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I'm George Knapp. We're back here at the Honeysuckle Ranch, our favorite down-to-town brothel,
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joined by my friend and colleague, Jeremy Corbell.
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And this is episode what? It's what number?
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This is element 115. I mean, episode 115.
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115, yeah. Which is appropriate given who our guest is.
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No way. Is he right here?
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He's just right here. And he just put out this fantastic new movie,
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a new look at the Bob Lazar story called S4, the Bob Lazar story.
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And it went to number one almost immediately in terms of congratulations, Luigi.
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Number one. What does that mean?
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I mean, from what I understand, we were number one on Amazon,
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most sold film in America on Amazon.
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And number one on IMDb and documentaries.
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Number one in and most popular, which is a huge surprise because obviously we weren't expecting it to be that popular.
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Well, you did have a good launching point as Joe Rogan, right?
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Yeah, that was great. Yeah. Joe was amazing.
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And so has Amazon said, hey, holy crap, look at this.
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We actually got a call a couple of days ago.
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So I think it's going to, I think what's going to happen is something,
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something different is going to happen very soon on Amazon and it's going to make everybody even more happy.
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I can't say what it is yet because we're just about to sign something, but it's, it's all positive from here.
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So it's great. Dermy, you've been down this road to what it's like making a film on Bob Lazar and the story.
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It's a unique privilege of insanity.
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Hey, it's a challenge dealing with Bob. I mean, you know, cause he is, you know, I know I've known him for a long time now
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and it's pulling Heath to get him to cooperate contrary to the public perception that, boy, he's just, he really loves attention
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and he loves talking about himself. Right. Which is, oh yeah, that's true.
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Yeah. So that, you know, man, you challenged me in the movie. That was like real.
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Remember in your pool room and like, we're out there and you're like, you gotta be one of the luckiest people.
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Maybe he'll talk to you. You were basically saying, you know, you had to be super lucky.
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I think back then compared to now, um, it was really hard to get him to come forward because he had done, you know, these segments with you,
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but he did not want the limelight. He did not want to be, he didn't want to repeat the story and get punched around again.
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Um, but I think that that moment, the way the world embraced him also going on Joe Rogan's,
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that was a big deal for, for Bob and me and the film. It, it swayed public opinion to where sure, you still got naysayers
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and people that just don't want to believe they made up their mind, but people weren't attacking him in the same way.
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And I think that that made a big difference to, to let him feel more comfortable.
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Now, Luigi, you know what that process is like. You didn't start out to make a documentary film.
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Uh, you, you had a product in mind and we don't have to go through the whole evolution.
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Right. But your approach to Bob was not, Hey, let's get you on camera at all.
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Yeah. Which really worked in your favor.
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Yeah. I mean, I think so, because when I first got, I first met Bob just taking notes with him.
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All I wanted to do is I said, Hey, do you mind if I put my phone here and I record us talking?
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So I don't have to take notes. And he said, actually, I prefer no recording.
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I don't want to be recorded. I don't want that. That was Bob right from the get go.
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So I said, no problem. And, and we went about doing what we had to do to get the model started.
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And as time progressed, I think he eventually saw what we started building and we built S4.
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And I said, it would be so cool if you could kind of run people through it.
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And then that went from that to making a doc. And then we had what we've, what you saw.
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It's kismet how it worked out for you, because if you had started with him saying, Hey, I'd really like that.
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We'd never have ever, it would never have happened. No, no chance at all. Zero.
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He had no interest whatsoever for that. And neither did Gene. Nobody had. It was just completely not on the table.
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It's a, you know, I, I've compared to Bob to a magpie. He likes, Ooh, sparkly things, you know, technology, virtual reality.
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You've shown him building a sport model die cast. Of course that would appeal to him.
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It's the kind of thing. If you'd started out any other way, it wouldn't have happened. And this was a four and a half year slog.
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Right. Right. Right. And that's the thing is like, it was, it was progress. It's, it took a while, you know, and it was like, as soon as the graphics started getting really cool.
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I, he always wanted me to show him stuff. I would not show him stuff on purpose because I wanted it to really look good.
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But sometimes I would give him a little, here, here's a screenshot. And he was like, my God, you know, he was like, that's incredible.
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So I think that got his attention. And I think from there, he started opening up to the fact like, wow, you can actually do this with tech now.
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And, and that's what made this become a reality. I think that was a big reason why he said, let's go, let's do it.
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Cause I can explain it so much, but then actually seeing it is so different. And in his mind, he's thinking, I got nothing else I got to say. I've done it. You can now see it, which is not true. The world's more on fire now than ever.
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I think, I think also is he was happy that it could correct a lot of wrongs out there, which you can, you guys know more than anybody.
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All this stuff. There's so, there was so, there's still so much wrong information on the Bob Lazar story out there because it's the telephone game for 40 years.
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So everybody, and intentionally, absolutely a lot of intentional misinformation. So this kind of like evens out the playing field, you know, you know, this is personal stuff.
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You take it as far as you want, but you had told us that, uh, you, you spent seven figures into seven figures to make this thing.
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I can't imagine how you can possibly make that. I can't even know if it's a big hit, but you know, we, as a joke, uh, you know, everybody accused it.
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You know, there's always the naysayers out there and they're, they're calling me a grifter because I made a film.
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And you know, the answer is this was not, uh, something that we had any guarantees on.
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So this is an investment that I had zero guarantees on and neither was it guaranteed that my, my team would benefit from it.
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Cause a lot of them poured their hearts and souls in it were like slept at the studio for months to make this happen.
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So they, their salaries were not actually covering the time they were investing. And that is a responsibility.
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I kept feeling that's a heavy burden on me because they have families, they have people that they rely on them.
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So for me, it was like, I really hope this works because I want to make them, you know, recoup all that.
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And so there's no, when you do something like this, nothing says it's going to make me money.
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It could be a huge investment that just flops and, and that's it.
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So, you know, uh, Bob likes to call me because of all the people saying things.
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He says, you know what, Luigi, let's call you a griftologist, you know?
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So it's just a funny thing.
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And it's like, for all the people saying this is a grift, I find that hilarious.
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Cause it's like, I didn't see that once I haven't recouped anything yet, by the way.
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You understand this is this tiny, tiny element of vocal people.
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There are so many people that are watching the film and appreciative of it existing.
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So just, you know, kind of with that shit, you just got to ignore it.
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I know when it comes to grifting, we need to go back to school.
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We usually because I mean, we put out a podcast that's free.
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I put out news stories that are free.
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It goes online for free.
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It's a radio show that I do.
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We need to start from scratch.
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Learn how this is done.
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we've talked privately before and Jeremy and I in the same sort of boat about, I stopped responding to stuff about Lazar a few years ago.
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I just, you know, did 25, 30 years of it, answering every question, going and giving public presentations, doing interviews, answering questions to the public.
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I still get 30 to 40 emails a day about Bob and I just don't do it anymore.
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It's not a productive use of my time.
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But I have to say that seeing your film has, has refired the engines up and ready to go on this stuff.
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Like before it was like getting him out was the hard part.
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Now he's out there, but we, we get to see everything in a, in a much kind of more clear way.
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Like, you know, I want to throw down and get dismissed the bullshit.
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Make sure people know, know the facts about it.
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I'll throw it down with you, man.
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And your film, you do address some of the things that are out there, but it's not like I'm going down the checklist of arguments about Bob.
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You cover a lot of it and you introduce some new voices in there.
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That hadn't been on previous.
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And some new evidence.
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And some new evidence.
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And the thing was, and as I said to you earlier, when I got started, when I, when we decided to do a film about this, the idea was not, let's go and do the typical, the arguments against one argument and the other.
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Maybe this is not true.
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I, the, the, the starting point was, all right, this happened.
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Let's get, let's just, let's consider this has occurred.
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What happened and what did he see?
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And that was a big step because now you could focus more on, let's go into the nitty gritty, the details of what Lazar said over 40, up close to 40 years ago and show it.
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So that way it's clear to the public.
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In fact, even the closest people to Bob, including his wife, Joy, when she first saw the film, she said, Oh my God.
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Now I understand certain things that Bob's been telling me for all these years because you're visually seeing it.
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So that has to have a value somewhere because as you, as we've seen, a lot of naysayers are, are cherry picking certain things that were already from a bad source.
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So they're, the starting information is wrong.
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And then they attack.
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Now this is an opportunity to see what it is that he saw.
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And you make your own judgment.
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You don't believe it, but that's the story.
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That is exactly what it was like.
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So, I mean, it's at least a different way of approaching this whole thing.
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And obviously we put in some evidence in the film that is clearly indicating that there's something that Bob said a long time ago that is real.
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He's the best psychic ever.
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Call him Nostradamus, you know?
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You know, I, I, I see the same arguments pop up again from the same people who I think have never fairly looked at the whole story.
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And, and we've been down this road for a long time is that people who become, they dig in their heels and it doesn't matter what you say about Bob.
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There are certain facts that they look at and they don't look at anything else.
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It's like ships passing in the night.
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Stan Friedman, the sainted late departed Stan Friedman, nuclear physicist who made it his cause to go after Bob at every chance.
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I love Stan Friedman.
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And he was a valued colleague and a good friend.
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And we had meetings where we'd sit down.
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Hey, let's talk this out.
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I understand your points about Bob not having degrees and, and I've said different things about that myself.
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I thought there were substance to him being at MIT and Caltech because I had talked to people who had been there, but I could never see Bob sitting in English lit to get a, you know, the only requirements other than scientific stuff and electrical engineering where he could get a degree.
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I never believed it.
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And so, yeah, that's a starting point for, I agree with you on that, but here's a whole lot of stuff that he saw that turned out to be true.
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How the hell did he know it?
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They don't want to hear it.
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They don't want to hear that stuff.
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The flights on Wednesday is just stuff that is like so rationally in your face, but there's irrational approaches of people, you know, just deciding they don't believe him and ignoring all the evidence.
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And Bob has explained the schooling to private lead a friend, family and certain people.
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And once you understand that you get it.
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And, you know, we've talked with people close to him at that time, but not everybody's going to do that.
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So I understand they're looking at the evidence that they have at this time.
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It's hard to fully accept a story like Bob's, but now we're living in a reality where because of you bringing him out back then or because him being scared enough to come out.
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The world has changed.
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I mean, this is a topic in Congress that we have a we have a representative going to bases to look for the NHI technology.
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All of that was born from this nexus point in Las Vegas in 1989 when you broke the story.
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Everybody's talking about it in Congress.
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I mean, even in ufology, which is weird enough on its own, reverse engineering crash saucers was not the heart and soul of the topic.
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That was still fringe.
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I mean, there was a Roswell case and some people who a lot of people who focused on that, but it was alien abductions and what the close encounters are like.
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That was the heart of it.
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Now the center of this topic is reverse engineering crash saucers bodies.
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That's what Congress is looking for.
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What's the president has been pressured to go ahead and get the bottom of it is.
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And I think a lot of it stems from Bob.
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And I say this all the time.
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Every time we talk about every time you hear people talking about Bob Lazar and his story, they immediately say things he was saying or things that were apparently happening, but they're not saying when he said it.
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That's an important thing is when was Bob Lazar talking about these things that that really puts the context in a, it puts everything in a different context.
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Anybody who's listening, who was alive and old enough to live through 1988 and 1989.
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First off is, and who knew anything about UFOs back in 1988, 1989.
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Talking about intact craft in the possession of the government was really fringe even in the UFO field.
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Talking about the U.S. Navy.
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Everybody was talking about the U.S. Air Force back then.
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The conversation about the U.S. Navy was not popular in 1989, specifically about flying saucers.
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George thought it was really weird.
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And so these are things that like were completely not even part of that sphere of that world.
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And here's a guy who apparently is trying to con the whole world and saying things that make absolute at that time intact craft that operate in the hands of the government.
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And the U.S. Navy is in charge.
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That was like, what the hell are you talking about?
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And that's what we're hearing now.
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Isn't that interesting?
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I mean, it's, it's, those are data points that I often say, let's go back that, let's go back to 89.
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What was happening in 89?
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It was the time machine.
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About how they operated to the, you know, how those craft operated back then.
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And now, you know, videos that you've helped secure, that we've helped secure and share with the public.
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Well, we've obtained and released them.
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We didn't see their shit, but, um, you know, how we want to look at that.
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They fell into our mailbox.
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Look, um, well, let's talk about that a little bit later in the episode.
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I want to talk about some of the stuff we have seen, you know, the whole belly first thing and everything he was saying.
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But first I want to acknowledge something.
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Um, drunk Bob is hilarious.
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You know, there's the, the drunk history.
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I don't think you've ever seen that show.
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You haven't watched it yet.
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But when, when Luigi and Bob, when they were on rodent show, he was like, you know, drinking whiskey on an empty stomach.
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And I could just see, you know, in him, I used to party with him back in the day a little bit, but I was just kind of seeing him.
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I was just kind of seeing it like the, the drunk barometer, but it's so funny.
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Cause he's, um, what you see is what you get with him.
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I thought, first of all, what was that like, you know, doing that?
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Uh, how was the, the road?
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Well, that was for, for me, you know, it's different for, I guess you guys have done this way.
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I was first experience for me.
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It was surreal to be in that room with Joe Rogan and Bob Lazar.
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And I remember saying to myself, all right, just, just stay quiet.
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You know, just sit in the background and kind of be a, a front row spectator to something that is such a cool, you know, and, and here I am listening to Bob and Joe talking and all that.
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And I can't thank Joe enough for all the support, uh, for the film.
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And I started seeing Bob, you know, he was starting to drink some of the whiskey, but I know Bob so well.
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And at a certain point in my head, I'm like, we didn't have breakfast.
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We didn't eat that much this morning.
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And I was like, I don't know if this is a good idea.
[0:16:46 - 0:16:49] ▶
Even I was like, not having a drink.
[0:16:49 - 0:16:52] ▶
Cause I'm like, dude, it was awesome.
[0:16:52 - 0:16:54] ▶
It wasn't too, it wasn't too much.
[0:16:54 - 0:16:55] ▶
It was just a soft, a looser, but he was like, you could, he was feeling it.
[0:16:55 - 0:16:59] ▶
But what it made me, I think what it also did.
[0:17:00 - 0:17:02] ▶
And I read this also in the comments, it made him real.
[0:17:02 - 0:17:05] ▶
I made him a human being.
[0:17:05 - 0:17:06] ▶
It's like, he's not, he, he had the, the fortitude and the courage to do that and be comfortable doing that.
[0:17:07 - 0:17:13] ▶
Anybody who's trying to like, hold on to some type of coordinated lie wouldn't take a risk of getting drunk on Joe Rogan.
[0:17:13 - 0:17:21] ▶
So it was unintentional.
[0:17:22 - 0:17:23] ▶
I think that it was not intentional.
[0:17:23 - 0:17:25] ▶
I remember him getting out of the, he's like, that was, I needed to eat something before, you know?
[0:17:25 - 0:17:30] ▶
So, but it was great.
[0:17:30 - 0:17:31] ▶
He handled himself great.
[0:17:31 - 0:17:33] ▶
I was just saying, my joke is that I really do want to see a drunk history of UFOs narrated by Bob.
[0:17:35 - 0:17:40] ▶
I would drink the whiskey with him and do it.
[0:17:40 - 0:17:42] ▶
That is a real offer.
[0:17:42 - 0:17:43] ▶
We're going, maybe we should do that.
[0:17:43 - 0:17:44] ▶
I can tell you that from back in the day when all this was hitting the fan, that Bob and I would go out here and there.
[0:17:44 - 0:17:50] ▶
And we were young men in Las Vegas and, and would take the pressure off and have a couple of drinks here and there.
[0:17:50 - 0:17:55] ▶
And he could hang, he could hang.
[0:17:55 - 0:17:57] ▶
And he, you know, he's not a drinker.
[0:17:59 - 0:18:00] ▶
I don't think he drinks at all at home.
[0:18:00 - 0:18:02] ▶
Well, he'll, he'll have a, he'll have a glass of wine or two.
[0:18:02 - 0:18:05] ▶
But what I think the whiskey is, is that's not wine.
[0:18:05 - 0:18:08] ▶
Some of this, along the way, you're investing.
[0:18:09 - 0:18:12] ▶
This is the future of your company.
[0:18:12 - 0:18:14] ▶
You're writing at risk.
[0:18:14 - 0:18:15] ▶
You're investing a lot of money.
[0:18:15 - 0:18:17] ▶
Almost all of your employees are all involved.
[0:18:17 - 0:18:19] ▶
You got to go into debt.
[0:18:19 - 0:18:20] ▶
You get to get loans, which is a little story.
[0:18:20 - 0:18:22] ▶
Was there a point at which you thought, holy crap, am I, am I gambling everything for a risky story?
[0:18:22 - 0:18:28] ▶
Are there holes in this that really worried you at all?
[0:18:28 - 0:18:33] ▶
Well, as far as the, actually, as far as the story is concerned, as far as the Bob Lazar story is concerned, I didn't, I didn't, I, I obviously at the very beginning, I wasn't sure.
[0:18:33 - 0:18:43] ▶
But as we progressed and we, we basically covered every point, I have to really also say a lot on, on behalf of my team, where they came into this very skeptical of the story.
[0:18:43 - 0:18:55] ▶
They didn't know who Bob Lazar was.
[0:18:55 - 0:18:56] ▶
So it's important to always remember, I was the only person on Project Gravator that knew who Bob Lazar was and what had happened.
[0:18:56 - 0:19:04] ▶
Cause you're a UFO guy.
[0:19:05 - 0:19:06] ▶
You have a history with that.
[0:19:06 - 0:19:07] ▶
And my sister who works with me, Veronica, had no idea.
[0:19:08 - 0:19:12] ▶
So she even came up to me.
[0:19:12 - 0:19:14] ▶
She goes, what, what are we doing?
[0:19:14 - 0:19:16] ▶
You know, she's like, are, are we doing something with a flying saucer and a hanger?
[0:19:16 - 0:19:21] ▶
Like what are you, what are you as a real story?
[0:19:21 - 0:19:23] ▶
What are you talking about?
[0:19:23 - 0:19:25] ▶
So that was also, it's important to note that.
[0:19:25 - 0:19:27] ▶
And Bob, when Bob found out none of them knew about him and none of them even believed it, he was like, that's great.
[0:19:27 - 0:19:34] ▶
He was happy about that.
[0:19:34 - 0:19:35] ▶
He's like, that's what we need.
[0:19:35 - 0:19:37] ▶
We don't need somebody who knows my story.
[0:19:37 - 0:19:39] ▶
I'd rather work with people who don't even believe my story.
[0:19:39 - 0:19:42] ▶
That was, that was a surprise even to them.
[0:19:42 - 0:19:44] ▶
And now as we kept going, all the holes were getting covered.
[0:19:44 - 0:19:50] ▶
They, they started realizing, oh, I think this is, this is real.
[0:19:50 - 0:19:54] ▶
Being in his presence in person.
[0:19:54 - 0:19:56] ▶
Is a very different thing.
[0:19:58 - 0:19:59] ▶
Being at a person in, like where we are right now.
[0:19:59 - 0:20:01] ▶
It, it, it doing it on a screen is one thing, but human to human contact is a totally different thing.
[0:20:01 - 0:20:08] ▶
They got to meet him.
[0:20:08 - 0:20:09] ▶
They got to see the tired Bob and the, you know, get a little headache, Bob or happy Bob.
[0:20:09 - 0:20:15] ▶
Or so they got to meet Bob Lazar.
[0:20:15 - 0:20:18] ▶
And that goes a long way in kind of judging a person's.
[0:20:18 - 0:20:22] ▶
And then there's a lot of people doing this.
[0:20:22 - 0:20:24] ▶
So it's not like one person on the team.
[0:20:24 - 0:20:26] ▶
It's like a whole group of people.
[0:20:26 - 0:20:28] ▶
And all of them went, oh, this is, this is real.
[0:20:28 - 0:20:32] ▶
So that was a big deal.
[0:20:32 - 0:20:34] ▶
Now, as far as holes in the story, what scared me most was how am I going to bring this out to the world?
[0:20:34 - 0:20:43] ▶
I could do the, I could make it, I can turn it into a thing, but how am I going to deliver this to people?
[0:20:43 - 0:20:51] ▶
And how am I going to, how are we going to do this in a way where it's accepted?
[0:20:51 - 0:20:55] ▶
It's, it's, it's, it's well received.
[0:20:55 - 0:20:57] ▶
And that was where I got kind of sidetracked a lot by a lot of people.
[0:20:57 - 0:21:01] ▶
And there was a lot of people that approached us and not everybody had good intentions.
[0:21:01 - 0:21:06] ▶
So that kind of scared my team because we saw how many traps are out there in film distribution.
[0:21:06 - 0:21:11] ▶
And just surrounding Bob, there's so many weirdos.
[0:21:11 - 0:21:14] ▶
I mean, even when I was a contact in the desert last year, I was, I wasn't even, I was just a visitor and I wasn't even involved in anything.
[0:21:15 - 0:21:23] ▶
And some people recognize me and they're like, are you the guy, you know, working on that story?
[0:21:23 - 0:21:27] ▶
It's going to come out soon.
[0:21:29 - 0:21:30] ▶
That looks so amazing.
[0:21:31 - 0:21:32] ▶
But Bob's a fucking fraud.
[0:21:32 - 0:21:34] ▶
And I was like, whoa, you know, that, that kind of threw me off with a lot of people.
[0:21:34 - 0:21:38] ▶
Thank you for your opinion.
[0:21:38 - 0:21:39] ▶
It's like, you're excited about this, but yet he's a fraud.
[0:21:39 - 0:21:42] ▶
You know, that kind of was like, what is, what is this?
[0:21:42 - 0:21:44] ▶
So I got that worried me sometimes.
[0:21:44 - 0:21:46] ▶
He's very polarizing his whole story.
[0:21:46 - 0:21:48] ▶
Because people are weird when it comes to Bali Azar.
[0:21:48 - 0:21:51] ▶
And, and I think that like we were saying, they've made up their, they've made up their mind.
[0:21:51 - 0:21:57] ▶
And so it's really difficult to go against somebody who's made up their mind.
[0:21:58 - 0:22:02] ▶
I could, I compare it to religious belief.
[0:22:02 - 0:22:04] ▶
If somebody was made up their mind, this is what I believe is, is God.
[0:22:04 - 0:22:10] ▶
Well, you're, let's say a Catholic is made up their mind.
[0:22:10 - 0:22:14] ▶
You're not going to have a Muslim come in and suddenly change their perspective on what they believe.
[0:22:14 - 0:22:19] ▶
Because they made up their mind.
[0:22:19 - 0:22:21] ▶
I sometimes compare it to that.
[0:22:21 - 0:22:23] ▶
And I'm like, if they don't want to believe Bali Azar, they're just going to find everything they can to not believe, regardless of what's presented to them with real factual evidence.
[0:22:23 - 0:22:35] ▶
So it's, it's a, it was a challenge for us to put it in a digestible format so that it could be entertaining, informative, historically accurate, visually accurate, and pleasant to watch.
[0:22:35 - 0:22:48] ▶
Yeah. It's got to be beautiful.
[0:22:48 - 0:22:49] ▶
It's got to be beautiful.
[0:22:49 - 0:22:50] ▶
It's got to have nice music.
[0:22:50 - 0:22:51] ▶
You're going to, you, you want to engage people and not have them just receive information that is hard because there's a lot of information to take in, in the film.
[0:22:51 - 0:23:01] ▶
A lot of technical stuff Bob gets into. There's a lot of it that didn't make the film because Bob gets real technical. Then a lot of people get upset.
[0:23:01 - 0:23:08] ▶
You should put that in there. We're going to have episodes on that.
[0:23:08 - 0:23:11] ▶
How long of a movie do you got?
[0:23:11 - 0:23:12] ▶
You know, it's like, you got to make the movie, but you have a, also a website. We'd be doing all the outtakes and...
[0:23:13 - 0:23:17] ▶
We're going to work. We, in the process of us finding a way to distribute the film. And I'm super happy that it worked out with Amazon and we're doing well on it.
[0:23:17 - 0:23:26] ▶
It's kicking ass. We also in, in parallel to us making that distribution deal, we developed our own channel, which is called WANA.
[0:23:27 - 0:23:37] ▶
We are not alone. And that we are not alone.com is where it's at right now, but it's going to be an actual app on any smart TV, smartphone, tablet, whatever.
[0:23:37 - 0:23:50] ▶
Like you, you download Paramount or Disney, you could download WANA. And in that, we're going to have all the extended interviews, the interviews you did with Bob, all the extended ones.
[0:23:50 - 0:24:01] ▶
So people can actually watch, because we abbreviated a lot of them in the film, but there's a, we have hours and hours like Gene Huff talking about all this stuff.
[0:24:01 - 0:24:10] ▶
Mario about all the stuff that was happening when they were getting followed.
[0:24:10 - 0:24:14] ▶
So that's going to be available on the WANA channel along with us creating, let's call them mini docs or long episodes, whatever you want to call them, where we dive deep into each aspect.
[0:24:14 - 0:24:28] ▶
So we're going to do a, probably an hour and a half piece on just the sport model, just the craft. We have so much data on that thing.
[0:24:28 - 0:24:36] ▶
We have so many beautiful visuals that are not even in the film. So we're going to have one on, on the sport model.
[0:24:36 - 0:24:41] ▶
Movie is just the beginning. I mean, you're going to have all this information. Everybody wants that, like more exactly Bob, just talk us through it.
[0:24:41 - 0:24:48] ▶
So it's so people, even the, for, for the people who have a lot to say against the story, the goal is not to come, not to change their minds.
[0:24:48 - 0:24:58] ▶
And this is something that I don't want to do. I don't want to come across as I'm trying to push this down your throat. Not at all.
[0:24:58 - 0:25:03] ▶
I want to give you facts or what we think are facts. You decide, you know, they, they could decide whether they're just finding it entertaining, whether they're finding it valuable information or whether they, you know, they just go, oh, whatever.
[0:25:03 - 0:25:17] ▶
It's, it's just sci-fi. Well, fine. Is it cool? Sci-fi?
[0:25:17 - 0:25:21] ▶
Yeah. Well, put it, put it on a table and let people come to their own conclusions. Yeah.
[0:25:21 - 0:25:26] ▶
You know, one of the hardest parts I have found over the years to convey is what it was really like back then, as you're saying, who was alive in 88 and 89, but to be around Bob, when everything hit the fan, how to convey what it was really like to be followed to, you know, the stories from Mario about, you had some of those as well, but to be around Bob when everything hit the fan.
[0:25:26 - 0:25:39] ▶
How to convey what it was really like to be followed to, you know, the stories from Mario about, you had some of those as well, but to be followed.
[0:25:39 - 0:25:46] ▶
You had some of those as well in your film about the break-ins at his house. Those things were really happening. It was a very tense time.
[0:25:46 - 0:25:54] ▶
And, you know, the, the, the idea that somebody was following us around, watching us go to a bar to have a meeting or breaking into his house and moving the furniture around, writing stuff on the board.
[0:25:54 - 0:26:04] ▶
You know, I can recall being called to Bob's house and he's peeking out these blinds, holding an Uzi and he's ready to shoot people.
[0:26:04 - 0:26:11] ▶
He was really afraid that it was going to be killed. And then to have them tap our phones at a news station.
[0:26:11 - 0:26:17] ▶
I mean, now we assume every, every phone is tapped. Every email is read by somebody.
[0:26:17 - 0:26:22] ▶
But back then it really was a jarring experience and unnerving and really pissed us off that it would be so outrageous, you know, damn good.
[0:26:22 - 0:26:31] ▶
And well, they didn't get a court order for that. They were just doing it.
[0:26:31 - 0:26:34] ▶
And then threatening people who offered to give information. It's hard to convey what that was like, but it was real.
[0:26:34 - 0:26:40] ▶
And it, it really set the tone for so much to come. You have people now, um, big brain guys that I'm, I'm on these different chat groups with the smart guys who will, as you said, it's like a game of telephone.
[0:26:40 - 0:26:53] ▶
Repeat the same, uh, rumors over and over as, as if there is fact, there is no rumor about Bob too scurrilous to not repeat again and again.
[0:26:53 - 0:27:02] ▶
He murdered his wife. Holy shit. Okay. You got some proof. He had murdered his wife. You're a citizen here. Report that stuff to the cops. Let them have it.
[0:27:02 - 0:27:11] ▶
Yeah. You know, or, you know, he got into trouble. There's no way he'd be hired for that program. You got a legal trouble. It happened after afterward.
[0:27:11 - 0:27:19] ▶
Uh, there's a very human side to that story. It just, uh, a human being absolutely was heartbroken at the time, made some bad choices, but it had nothing to do with the program or what he saw or the stuff about his education.
[0:27:19 - 0:27:31] ▶
The stuff about his education. Look, man, if, if you think that the heart of this and soul of the story is where Bob went to school, you're missing the boat big time.
[0:27:31 - 0:27:39] ▶
And we put that in the very first story that we heard about Bob, the schools he said he went to have no record of it. That's in there.
[0:27:39 - 0:27:46] ▶
So somebody else a year later, Stan Friedman goes to MIT and Caltech and finds they didn't have any records of them.
[0:27:46 - 0:27:53] ▶
It's like a gotcha moment. Hey, were you paying attention? We already did this. You know?
[0:27:53 - 0:27:57] ▶
Yeah. Let me ask you something about, so, you know, very famously, so Bob, through a bunch of shenanigans, they get a piece of element 115, they bring it to his fucking house.
[0:27:57 - 0:28:06] ▶
And he's curious to see, can he replicate some of its, um, elemental principles or whatever he was seeing that they put it in a wave guide or cloud chamber test.
[0:28:06 - 0:28:16] ▶
And I just like, you were there. So there you are with the 115 in the puck and he's got it in this cloud chamber experiment.
[0:28:16 - 0:28:23] ▶
I know you're not a scientist. You always say, but what did you see that?
[0:28:23 - 0:28:26] ▶
It bent. It bent. There was a laser that was filed for the shot through this cloud chamber and it bent.
[0:28:26 - 0:28:33] ▶
Now, I don't know how you bend light. You saw with your own eyes. I saw it with my own eyes. I'm gonna have it on videotape.
[0:28:33 - 0:28:38] ▶
That is something that I take very seriously. And I, and I really, really ask the audience or everybody to suspend judgment and think about that for a second, because this has everything to do with credibility of the story and not just Bob Lazar.
[0:28:38 - 0:28:52] ▶
And I say this all the time and I'm so glad and honored to be here with you, George, because you're part of it and you're a huge part of it.
[0:28:52 - 0:28:58] ▶
And the fact is every time I hear people attacking Bob Lazar for me in my ear, it's saying, well, you're, you're automatically attacking George Knapp.
[0:28:58 - 0:29:05] ▶
You're attacking Gene Hoffman. You saw the craft, something that we have to consider. You saw a light that in a cloud.
[0:29:05 - 0:29:11] ▶
You've got a journalist who's not sold on the story. He's fucking seeing it. They invite him over and you got George Knapp saying, I saw the laser bend in the cloud.
[0:29:11 - 0:29:20] ▶
I'm not a scientist. Don't know what it means. How do you bend a laser? I don't fucking know how to bend a laser, but he was doing it for his own gratification to see if he could replicate an experiment.
[0:29:20 - 0:29:29] ▶
Look, it's no secret that he got a piece of element 115. I know there's some stuff we don't talk about shenanigans after, but the thing is you saw it in operation.
[0:29:29 - 0:29:38] ▶
And in fact, let's just get past this hard part. It was filmed and they gave George, Bob gave George the original. We tore about his house.
[0:29:38 - 0:29:47] ▶
We tore up his house for years. Brown case looking for this. He wants to put it out to the world. Bob was hoping he could find it.
[0:29:47 - 0:29:53] ▶
He was bummed that George, somehow it got out of George's possession, but you're, you're telling us for a fact you were there.
[0:29:53 - 0:29:59] ▶
You saw this and, and there, there is a tape of it somewhere. We just, you just can't find it.
[0:29:59 - 0:30:04] ▶
Yeah. And you have a piece of it. You found the piece.
[0:30:04 - 0:30:06] ▶
I did find a piece of it.
[0:30:06 - 0:30:07] ▶
Was somebody who recorded over it.
[0:30:07 - 0:30:08] ▶
Not the one, just the tape. Yeah.
[0:30:08 - 0:30:10] ▶
I saw it yesterday at the time we're recording this. It's the day before we're recording this, uh, on one of the social media platforms, somebody saying, this is bullshit. It can't be possible.
[0:30:10 - 0:30:21] ▶
Bob Lazar smuggled a pound and a half of 115 out of S4.
[0:30:21 - 0:30:24] ▶
That's not what I'm going to have down out of very 51. I see. Yeah, that is impossible. Cause it did not happen. Yeah. He didn't steal.
[0:30:24 - 0:30:31] ▶
I'm at one. Yeah. He didn't steal it from anywhere. He happened to get some.
[0:30:31 - 0:30:35] ▶
He had, as we say, as jurors, some, somehow he pinged it from a place where it is machine machine. Yeah. And, um, that part of the story is way out, man. That's been out for a while.
[0:30:35 - 0:30:46] ▶
He had it. Uh, let's talk about what you learned about 115, because that's another argument. Well, 115 doesn't act anything like Bob.
[0:30:46 - 0:30:54] ▶
That is stable. I say they made an isotope out of it. It lasts microseconds. It's, it doesn't propel spaceships. And so it, you can't be real.
[0:30:54 - 0:31:03] ▶
And that's actually something that you even hear. What I find really interesting about the 115 comments where people are, the naysayers are saying, that's not real. That's not what, you know, it's all, it's all bullshit.
[0:31:03 - 0:31:13] ▶
The 115 decay, the 115 we synthesized in 2013. Microseconds.
[0:31:13 - 0:31:18] ▶
It's like, it decays in microseconds. Anybody who's a scientist, anybody who knows the periodic table and, and, and the, the, the way, uh, isotopes work.
[0:31:18 - 0:31:28] ▶
There are many different isotopes of different elements. Gold has many, hydrogen has three. So there's different isotopes.
[0:31:28 - 0:31:36] ▶
The isotope that was synthesized decays. Like there, I think gold, I can't remember which number of the, which gold is.
[0:31:36 - 0:31:42] ▶
The, which gold isotope decays. That's right. Really? I think there's like 24. Yeah. One of them, it decays as fast as 115.
[0:31:42 - 0:31:48] ▶
So it's like, but there's, uh, there's actual, a stable gold. We have, we have it on our rings. We have it. So it is a hundred percent going to happen eventually.
[0:31:48 - 0:31:57] ▶
Who knows when that we will either synthesize it, discover it, find out about it more that there will be a stable version of that.
[0:31:57 - 0:32:05] ▶
Anybody that works on this, who's honest. Let's say, so I called at George's house. I still have the recording.
[0:32:05 - 0:32:11] ▶
This Russian scientist who works specifically with heavy elements. This was like 10 years ago.
[0:32:11 - 0:32:17] ▶
And I called this guy and went through the whole thing with him. And then he started catching on. He, he said, wait a second.
[0:32:17 - 0:32:23] ▶
Is this about UFOs? And that's when he clammed up. But before that, he's not about 115. He's like, of course, we're going to find a stable element.
[0:32:23 - 0:32:30] ▶
Uh, I still, at some point. And then it was like the allergy to you. He realized, and he just like, boom, can't pause without it.
[0:32:30 - 0:32:37] ▶
But until then everything was correct information, you know? Yeah. Um, and Lazar always said, look, I don't know where it came from.
[0:32:37 - 0:32:43] ▶
I think it had it for us to make it the stable version of it would take so much energy. I don't know if we're ever going to be able to accomplish it.
[0:32:43 - 0:32:50] ▶
In value, in weight, in weight, in weight. It had to be a natural element from a super heavy element created by a double star system or something like that. He was just guessing.
[0:32:50 - 0:32:58] ▶
Apparently the information they gave him again, this is some, Bob says this all the time. This is information they gave him.
[0:32:58 - 0:33:05] ▶
Right. He doesn't know four fucks. Okay. And he says, apparently they had 500 pounds of it. Yeah.
[0:33:05 - 0:33:10] ▶
But he says, I don't know that. They could have been, they could have been a lie. You know, what, what tells me they had a five, where was it? He didn't see it. He didn't see the stack. He would have to see it.
[0:33:10 - 0:33:21] ▶
But when they took it to machine it, you know, the idea that you'd kind of bring the scraps to, I mean, they're cutting it up. I mean, I'm theorizing, but it sounded like, you know, they, they did have a, most likely they had some of it.
[0:33:21 - 0:33:33] ▶
Absolutely. And it, it, it, the original piece, well, according to what he had seen, Dennis actually, uh, one time walked in the lab holding, uh, they look like, uh, coins or like, you know, pucks, little pucks of one for being machine to be machined.
[0:33:33 - 0:33:48] ▶
They were about like, I think it was like, uh, I think he said they were a quarter inch thick or something like that, because that's the little, the little grooves you see in the, in the triangle is each puck.
[0:33:48 - 0:33:58] ▶
Right. So he said, Dennis walked into the lab holding a little stack. And he said he was in a hurry to leave it on the table. Like he didn't want to hold onto it too long.
[0:33:58 - 0:34:08] ▶
Oh. He, he said that he goes, Dennis came in and was kind of like, you know, something like hot, like, let me put it on the table. He, he, he made that. I couldn't put it in the film because it just, I would have had to create a whole scene out of it.
[0:34:08 - 0:34:21] ▶
And, but that's what Bobby got to pull out of his pants, holding it by his balls. Right.
[0:34:21 - 0:34:25] ▶
You know, here's Dennis Mariani coming into the lab and leaving a stack of, of, of, of puck. You know, this means that somehow somewhere there's somebody, I mean, I'm not going to put it in the table.
[0:34:25 - 0:34:37] ▶
There's somebody and Bob keeps saying it. There's someone who knows more. There's someone in this whole chain that has the bigger picture.
[0:34:37 - 0:34:45] ▶
Of course. Because here he is, he goes, I'm only telling you what I saw. Right.
[0:34:45 - 0:34:50] ▶
But that was just a man walking in the room and putting something on the table. What, where did that man get it? And who gave it to that man? And then what other man is there? And what does that guy do?
[0:34:50 - 0:35:01] ▶
And when, what people don't think about a budget. So, and this is where it gets lost in translation a little bit.
[0:35:01 - 0:35:06] ▶
Um, is it, they were machining it at Los Alamos under LA 1000. And the idea was that it was an armor. That's what they said.
[0:35:06 - 0:35:13] ▶
That's right. LA 1000.
[0:35:13 - 0:35:14] ▶
They'd actually move it. They'd have to take it to where they had the machining skill to cut it so precisely. Maybe that's where the leak was, is that when you machine something.
[0:35:14 - 0:35:23] ▶
Is there a shabbing?
[0:35:23 - 0:35:24] ▶
Or the leak was, is there a shabbing? And you can kind of also maybe, I'm just theorizing how it would get into Bob's possession.
[0:35:24 - 0:35:30] ▶
Because obviously you're not taking that out of sight for. So I'm trying to give a hint to people.
[0:35:30 - 0:35:34] ▶
You don't take it out of sight for it. Let me ask you something.
[0:35:34 - 0:35:36] ▶
This is something people don't get to talk about. We could talk about it.
[0:35:36 - 0:35:38] ▶
He ever tell you the Burger King camera story?
[0:35:38 - 0:35:40] ▶
Tell that story right now.
[0:35:42 - 0:35:43] ▶
Because a lot of people haven't, uh, tell that story.
[0:35:44 - 0:35:46] ▶
Do you want to tell her? Should I?
[0:35:46 - 0:35:47] ▶
Uh, go ahead. Go ahead.
[0:35:47 - 0:35:48] ▶
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
[0:35:48 - 0:35:49] ▶
The premise here, this is real world shit, man.
[0:35:49 - 0:35:51] ▶
I looked this up from my movie. It's like, what was the Burger King camera that came with like a Happy Meal back in the day?
[0:35:51 - 0:35:56] ▶
So here's what happened, according to Bob, is that, um, he was really thinking, man, no one's going to believe me.
[0:35:56 - 0:36:02] ▶
This is so crazy. He's already feeling the heat.
[0:36:02 - 0:36:04] ▶
So he got one of these meals from Burger King and there's, there happened, and he loves Burger King for the day.
[0:36:04 - 0:36:08] ▶
And there happens to be one of these little cameras in there.
[0:36:08 - 0:36:11] ▶
And it was just small enough. He was describing, it's just smaller. If you could take this and you might be able to get it in.
[0:36:11 - 0:36:16] ▶
So, you know, big balls, blazar brings this camera into S4, but he was never able to get it out.
[0:36:16 - 0:36:25] ▶
So one day somewhere there is a table that was at site four where he put it, you know, getting super nervous, put it inside the leg of your table.
[0:36:25 - 0:36:33] ▶
And he's like, I could never recover it. I was never asked to come back to work.
[0:36:34 - 0:36:37] ▶
You know, so there's a half-baked plan, very lazar. You're thinking he's out, this camera out.
[0:36:37 - 0:36:42] ▶
Somewhere there's a camera outside four in the leg of a table, apparently.
[0:36:42 - 0:36:46] ▶
Look, there's a grifting outside.
[0:36:46 - 0:36:47] ▶
There's a grifting opportunity, Burger King spokesperson.
[0:36:47 - 0:36:51] ▶
Is that how you understand this?
[0:36:51 - 0:36:53] ▶
That's exactly what he said. It was, it was so interesting.
[0:36:53 - 0:36:56] ▶
Cause I, I got the information, I read the information somewhere.
[0:36:56 - 0:36:58] ▶
So I went up to him, I said, Bob, was there a camera that you brought?
[0:36:58 - 0:37:02] ▶
And he just looked at, we were driving. He just looks at me. He goes, yeah.
[0:37:02 - 0:37:07] ▶
I said, oh yeah. Tell me, you know, he says, it's still there.
[0:37:07 - 0:37:12] ▶
He goes, I never got it out of there, but he goes, I, I didn't know where to put it.
[0:37:12 - 0:37:16] ▶
I didn't want to show Barry. I had it.
[0:37:16 - 0:37:17] ▶
So he, he took the, the capping off the bottom of one of the desks and stuck it in the leg and closed it up.
[0:37:17 - 0:37:23] ▶
He goes, it's, I, if the desk is still there, it's still there. It's not, you know.
[0:37:23 - 0:37:28] ▶
Of course, a detail like that, obviously he made that whole thing up, you know, cause that's where, how his brain operates.
[0:37:28 - 0:37:33] ▶
Yeah. That, that is so not Bob Lazard. Bob is not somebody who wants to talk about this stuff.
[0:37:33 - 0:37:40] ▶
So when he, whenever you hear something like that, you go, yeah, it must be, it must be real.
[0:37:40 - 0:37:44] ▶
Cause Bob usually doesn't get into this stuff.
[0:37:44 - 0:37:46] ▶
You know that from knowing him. That's the thing is that, um, you know, if somebody is willing to make shit up in their daily life, cause that then you could see there, but he is so factually.
[0:37:46 - 0:37:55] ▶
I think he's become that way too, because he's been so harmed by people dissecting every element of every word.
[0:37:55 - 0:38:02] ▶
And sometimes he misspeaks, man. He called the, he called it furniture and seats or something.
[0:38:02 - 0:38:07] ▶
People jumped on him for a decade about that. So he's so careful about the words he uses cause he's been so attacked, man.
[0:38:07 - 0:38:13] ▶
In fact, if it's funny that you talk about that particular statement, he, he said in an interview with you, many years on the couch.
[0:38:13 - 0:38:21] ▶
And he said, you know, why would they have little furniture in there?
[0:38:21 - 0:38:24] ▶
Now, if you think about that for a second and you think if, if a person is lying, right?
[0:38:24 - 0:38:29] ▶
If a person is making up a story and they're making up a story of seats in a spacecraft, you wouldn't call it little furniture.
[0:38:29 - 0:38:36] ▶
It was a ton of things.
[0:38:37 - 0:38:39] ▶
You know what I mean? Like that's a weird thing.
[0:38:39 - 0:38:41] ▶
And the sidearm, remember he got nailed for saying sidearm because it was not like an actual sidearm.
[0:38:41 - 0:38:46] ▶
People just pick apart the nonsense shit they want to do to try to discount what he's saying.
[0:38:47 - 0:38:51] ▶
Actually, George, I'll say something that happened when you, you and Bob were on stage.
[0:38:51 - 0:38:56] ▶
I don't remember what year it was. It could have been 2014, 15 in Arizona.
[0:38:56 - 0:39:00] ▶
Bob Lazar stood up and made a drawing on the whiteboard of the, the doors, the adjacent doors in the hangers.
[0:39:00 - 0:39:07] ▶
Okay. There's these, what he did is he put this little door on, on the, on the whiteboard.
[0:39:07 - 0:39:14] ▶
And I read all these comments. Okay. Of people saying there's no way that if that little door was open, that he could see the whole facility.
[0:39:14 - 0:39:23] ▶
And without ever mentioning anything to Bob, I knew that. I thought that that's a good point. They're right. It's true.
[0:39:23 - 0:39:31] ▶
If it's just a normal standard door, that's a good point they have. There's no way to see how far, if it's, it's just a little door in every hanger, I wouldn't be able to, cause I built it.
[0:39:31 - 0:39:41] ▶
Cause I built it. And he, and as he was giving us the details of the big sliding door, he says each sliding door had a door in it.
[0:39:41 - 0:39:51] ▶
Yeah. Clarity all of a sudden.
[0:39:51 - 0:39:54] ▶
Oh, okay. So it's, he says the big door was open, but so was that little door as well.
[0:39:54 - 0:40:01] ▶
Cause it hadn't been opened all the way. And he says, so I must've just drew that. Cause that's, but he says the whole thing had a door in it, which is what you'll see in what you see in the film.
[0:40:01 - 0:40:10] ▶
Which made me go, well, now that makes sense.
[0:40:10 - 0:40:13] ▶
Yeah. That was interesting in a previous conversation we had about how, as you're doing these renderings of what it could look like, how it spurs his memory, things that he would not otherwise remember.
[0:40:13 - 0:40:24] ▶
Hey, there was a door over here. Here's the work bench. Here's the, you know, he suddenly things come back to him. Here's the color of the paint.
[0:40:24 - 0:40:31] ▶
A huge one, a huge one. I'll tell you, I haven't talked about this. Actually. I just remembered this now from like three years ago.
[0:40:31 - 0:40:38] ▶
I, we were, we wanted to make sure the lab, the propulsion lab was as accurate as possible because that's where he spent most of his time.
[0:40:38 - 0:40:45] ▶
Yeah. So I asked Bob, this is where I really, really, I begged Bob, please provide us as much cause there was so much in there. So he was really great.
[0:40:45 - 0:40:55] ▶
He sent, he sent me a bunch of emails here. This is what the cabinets look like. He would go online and try to find something that would give us a, you know, we had all these equipment.
[0:40:55 - 0:41:05] ▶
So we built the lab and he showed us how it was laid out, built the lab and we bring him in there and he goes, well, you're missing the door.
[0:41:05 - 0:41:14] ▶
Okay. So the lab, the propulsion lab, if you're in the hallway of S4, there were two entrances to the lab.
[0:41:14 - 0:41:24] ▶
There was a door, an initial door closer to the entrance of S4. You have to walk maybe 20, 30 feet.
[0:41:24 - 0:41:31] ▶
And then there's another door that, so both of them lead into the lab, but there is a door that led from the lab into the hangar.
[0:41:31 - 0:41:39] ▶
He thought he had mentioned that to us. So he kept saying, there's a door missing. And I kept saying, well, no, the, the two doors are there. He goes, no, going into the hangar.
[0:41:41 - 0:41:50] ▶
And I thought, oh, there's a door. He goes, because now he's there. And he goes, yeah, there's a door. And I said, Bob, you never said that. He goes, oh my God. Yeah. There's a door there.
[0:41:50 - 0:42:01] ▶
Right. Because you're re-remembering. You're re-remembering because he said, that's the door Barry and I used when Dennis called us out at the test flight.
[0:42:01 - 0:42:10] ▶
I, we opened that door and that's when I could see the whole facility because all the adjacent doors were open.
[0:42:10 - 0:42:16] ▶
Does that sound like somebody who's just making it up on the flight? No, it doesn't.
[0:42:16 - 0:42:19] ▶
No, it doesn't because it's like somebody who's really remembering something. That's the magic of it. Right. So that made it so much more real also for us.
[0:42:19 - 0:42:29] ▶
Because you could clearly see he wasn't trying to make something up. He was just remembering that. That's it.
[0:42:29 - 0:42:35] ▶
My joke is re-remembering, but it is just remembering. Yeah. Remembering. Yeah. You know, again, back to the people who are the diehard boots in the ground.
[0:42:35 - 0:42:43] ▶
They're not going to believe it no matter what. And the stories that they repeat, you know, they, I think it boils down to for a lot of them.
[0:42:43 - 0:42:51] ▶
Look, if there was going to be a program like this, they'd ask me to be in it and not Bob Lazar.
[0:42:51 - 0:42:56] ▶
And Bob had said for the beginning, I shouldn't have been there. I shouldn't have been the guy for that.
[0:42:56 - 0:43:01] ▶
They are much better people that, but they picked me. And I, I, you know, we all came to the belief that over the years, Bob was the perfect guy in the sense that he thought outside the box.
[0:43:01 - 0:43:11] ▶
Obviously he still does. He was smart. They needed a different viewpoint because they were stuck and they would need somebody that who was smart enough to help them.
[0:43:11 - 0:43:21] ▶
But if they needed to discredit them, it would be easy. And there are so many things in his life that you could use that have been used.
[0:43:21 - 0:43:28] ▶
And, and so I, I had always believed that maybe he was the most qualified person for that particular assignment.
[0:43:28 - 0:43:34] ▶
You know, it was so siloed and so confidential and classified. They could not bring in Eric Weinstein to be part of it.
[0:43:34 - 0:43:42] ▶
Exactly. And, and also for, you know, for context, you, we see it in the, in the film and everybody knows the story.
[0:43:42 - 0:43:50] ▶
Bob Lazar put a jet engine on, in a Honda Civic. Sometimes people just say Honda, a Honda Civic, which is a pretty small car now.
[0:43:50 - 0:44:01] ▶
And it's a 1979 Honda Civic. The, the, the important point to take from that is that back then jet cars were a thing.
[0:44:01 - 0:44:12] ▶
They were fucking long. They had parachutes on them. They, they, people would have like these protective bars.
[0:44:12 - 0:44:20] ▶
This is a guy who decided to put a jet engine in a Honda Civic and made it work and brought it to, I just asked him the other day, how fast did it go?
[0:44:20 - 0:44:30] ▶
He goes 202 miles an hour. Now that's a wild thing. Yeah. Okay. So that, that feat, that thing that he did on his own,
[0:44:30 - 0:44:41] ▶
he said that project was just an ongoing project that kept making that car better and better over the years.
[0:44:41 - 0:44:46] ▶
But that did catch the attention of Ed Teller because Ed Teller was at Los Alamos reading about the jet car.
[0:44:46 - 0:44:53] ▶
It's a very unique thing. And not only did that, that must have, that caught his attention, but it's also, who's this kid who put a jet engine on a Honda Civic?
[0:44:53 - 0:45:04] ▶
You know, saying I put a jet engine on a vehicle might not have been as wow as saying on a Honda Civic.
[0:45:04 - 0:45:12] ▶
I think that really kind of makes you remember the person. Yeah.
[0:45:12 - 0:45:16] ▶
So, you know, the fact that Lazar was this unique, we don't, we don't, I haven't heard of people done that.
[0:45:16 - 0:45:23] ▶
We ever heard of that? And people don't. On a Honda Civic or in a normal car?
[0:45:23 - 0:45:26] ▶
He put jet engines on a bicycle back then. Yeah. Yeah. Actually there's one footage I got of him putting it on a hang glider. Yeah. Yeah. Fuck.
[0:45:26 - 0:45:35] ▶
He's putting jet engines on everything. And when you're talking about that, you don't just stick a jet engine onto something.
[0:45:35 - 0:45:40] ▶
Like the whole fuel system itself is more impressive than the part you see blasting. So he was really doing unique stuff.
[0:45:40 - 0:45:46] ▶
I mean, he also did this whole thing with back in the day when people didn't really know that hydrogen could be a fuel for car.
[0:45:46 - 0:45:52] ▶
Yeah. That's right. He powered all his cars. You went to the ranch in New Mexico where he had the particle accelerator to help with what they needed to do elementally to fuel.
[0:45:52 - 0:46:02] ▶
Fuel. Yeah. I mean, people just don't know that. Yeah. Non-scientist Bob, who's a complete phony.
[0:46:02 - 0:46:07] ▶
I went to go see him. It might've been for the 25th anniversary of the store. He's in New Mexico. There had been a raid that we could talk about elsewhere.
[0:46:07 - 0:46:16] ▶
But I'm walking around the property. So are these your Corvette, your cars are powered by hydrogen? Yeah. I'm working on this little system and GM is interested in it.
[0:46:16 - 0:46:25] ▶
We might move to Michigan. You make your own fuel, hydrogen fuel. Yeah. And you do that. How? Well, let's back here.
[0:46:25 - 0:46:32] ▶
You know, there's a building behind the house where he lives and there's this giant tube through it. It's like 30, 40 feet long.
[0:46:32 - 0:46:39] ▶
Oh yeah. That's my particle accelerator that I built to create this fuel that goes into the hydrogen system.
[0:46:39 - 0:46:45] ▶
Because everybody builds it. Because everybody does. Yeah. Exactly.
[0:46:45 - 0:46:48] ▶
It's like practical stuff all along the way. It's wild. You know, so I mean, he is the guy that you'd want to shake shit up and to try to get an answer or even a question that hasn't been asked before.
[0:46:48 - 0:46:59] ▶
You know, that's what they were trying to do with. Can you imagine, you know, you have a security clearance and there's an investigation and maybe it lasts a year and they dig up all kinds of stuff through your whole life.
[0:46:59 - 0:47:08] ▶
Can you imagine having a security clearance level investigation of everything you've done in your life for 37 years, which is what he has faced?
[0:47:08 - 0:47:16] ▶
There's an army of people who hate Bob Lazar who spend their time creating websites and all sorts of stuff.
[0:47:16 - 0:47:23] ▶
Websites and then go to every girlfriend he's ever had. Every coworker, anyone he's ever borrowed money from.
[0:47:23 - 0:47:30] ▶
They look at every financial record. Have you had some, have you ever told some lies?
[0:47:30 - 0:47:34] ▶
And you're like, have you ever had some problems where you cheated on a girlfriend or allegedly?
[0:47:34 - 0:47:39] ▶
No, I didn't know. Or where, you know, you borrowed some money and you were slow paying it back.
[0:47:39 - 0:47:44] ▶
Maybe that, you know, you know, everybody has stuff like that in their life.
[0:47:44 - 0:47:48] ▶
And they dig this stuff up and then amplify it so many times.
[0:47:48 - 0:47:51] ▶
I saw again, my brainiac group of people on a signal chat group, they raised the name of Mark Farmer, a guy who investigated Bob, went to Los Alamos, dug up people who had borrowed money or he'd borrowed money from and paid it back.
[0:47:51 - 0:48:06] ▶
And then we're trying to get them to say that was something funny about Bob because he hired teenagers to work in his business.
[0:48:06 - 0:48:12] ▶
He hired him because it's cheap labor. Yeah. But they're insinuating, well, was he messing around with the kids? No.
[0:48:12 - 0:48:18] ▶
You sure he wasn't messing around with the kids? No. On this, on the thread, they're trying to say this.
[0:48:18 - 0:48:23] ▶
Yeah. I've got the transcript of the whole interview process.
[0:48:23 - 0:48:26] ▶
And at the end, the guy still says, well, it's good to know that he was trying to fool around with his teenage kids after the guy who was there said no twice, two or three times.
[0:48:26 - 0:48:34] ▶
So, you know, can you imagine having an army of anti UFO people digging into every aspect of your life over this many years?
[0:48:34 - 0:48:42] ▶
It would be a nightmare. And I also you guys being journalists, you know,
[0:48:42 - 0:48:48] ▶
I know this. It's how people word things sometimes. It's just the frame of the framing of a sentence.
[0:48:48 - 0:48:54] ▶
Sometimes if I if I say something like, you know, today I'm going to be talking with these two amazing journalists about all these things that are happening in the UFO community.
[0:48:54 - 0:49:04] ▶
That's one way of framing it. What if I say to somebody, you know, today I'm going to be talking about with these two journalists.
[0:49:04 - 0:49:10] ▶
It's just a framing of it. Now, suddenly I said the exact same thing. If you read it, it's the same words, but it's the way I deliver it.
[0:49:10 - 0:49:18] ▶
It that is completely different. Every time people talk about Bob Lazar, a lot of people talk about Bob Lazar.
[0:49:18 - 0:49:24] ▶
They put that negative connotation that that emotional negativity on it. So it it it's psychologically reframes and it prepares everybody to question it instead of listening to it.
[0:49:24 - 0:49:36] ▶
And that is a big unfortunate thing that's been happening.
[0:49:36 - 0:49:39] ▶
Battlefield for credibility. You know, it seeps out into all areas.
[0:49:39 - 0:49:42] ▶
The journalism is one, but also just as something as stupid as Wikipedia. My God, they've had them listed as a conspiracy.
[0:49:42 - 0:49:49] ▶
There's a conspiracy. He doesn't know shit about conspiracy. He doesn't follow that shit. He's never been.
[0:49:49 - 0:49:54] ▶
But that is a reframing that a lot of people go to Wikipedia to find out who somebody is.
[0:49:54 - 0:49:58] ▶
Yeah. Until Grokopedia takes over, which it already is. Yeah. Better by the way. Yeah. True. I've seen it. It's incredible.
[0:49:58 - 0:50:04] ▶
They've just hammered a mine and George's profiles. All this. It's bullshit. It's nonsense.
[0:50:04 - 0:50:09] ▶
If I could read so much nonsense about me, I can only imagine the nonsense about Bob. So the thing is, is that when you reframe it with something like that, that's the battlefield.
[0:50:09 - 0:50:16] ▶
It's, it's, it's always going to be from social media, you know, through Wikipedia, all that shit, man.
[0:50:16 - 0:50:21] ▶
And, and it does, it changes the way that people first engage a story. They're not by the facts, but by an opinion based attitude.
[0:50:21 - 0:50:27] ▶
Um, Bigelow. Bigelow. That's another one that's been repeated over and over.
[0:50:29 - 0:50:37] ▶
Bigelow found out he's a fraud and kicked him out. You know, they ended their business. And, uh, uh, you know, that Bob had tried to pass off aerogel as element 115.
[0:50:37 - 0:50:47] ▶
And that's why Bigelow kicked him out, which of course I remember when the aerogel, which was sort of a packing material that something else was in when it arrived.
[0:50:47 - 0:50:56] ▶
And I looked at that. That's the 115, by the way, man, that is some weird stuff. What is this? He goes, I have no idea. It came with this package of other things.
[0:50:56 - 0:51:04] ▶
And, uh, so it never happened that way, but it's been repeated often enough over. And, and, uh, some of people who worked for Bigelow who were hired years after the whole Lazar thing was over are, are the most ardent critics of Lazar and have the story wrong.
[0:51:04 - 0:51:18] ▶
And hopefully, but if you ask Bigelow, which I did, which you did on camera after 20 years in like two minutes, George clears up that long running conspiracy rumor.
[0:51:18 - 0:51:27] ▶
He has big law on and asked him straight up about Lazar.
[0:51:27 - 0:51:30] ▶
And he believes him. He says, I believe him to this day. I think he was telling the truth. And I didn't end the relationship, the business relationship because aerogel or 115.
[0:51:30 - 0:51:39] ▶
It was that Bob made a mistake and stored some furniture in that office for like a two day period and just got caught.
[0:51:39 - 0:51:45] ▶
Yeah. And Bigelow who is a tough employer. Well, I, I even, it's funny. I, it's a topic we just covered. And Bob said his, he had a friend, Jim in Los Angeles that was going to come and work with him.
[0:51:45 - 0:51:57] ▶
And he said, Jim sent his stuff. It was furniture and it was in the lab. And this woman came in that worked for Bigelow and started going, what's all this, you know?
[0:51:57 - 0:52:05] ▶
And, and he said, this is, this is some stuff that Jim is going to raise. And so apparently that sparked some type of like bad response from Bigelow.
[0:52:05 - 0:52:14] ▶
And he said, what the hell are you doing? This is not a storage. It's just, it's just tables and stuff that we're going to use, which just here until Jim gets here.
[0:52:14 - 0:52:21] ▶
And that just broke the, it kind of went, he said it just went sideways really fast.
[0:52:21 - 0:52:26] ▶
Yeah. And it ended that relationship, but they had nothing to do with Bob pretending that the aerogel is element. All that's bullshit.
[0:52:26 - 0:52:33] ▶
That's George's point. Is it like something happened? And then even later employees of Bigelow have continued to pass around this false narrative about, you know, Bob, you know, pretending aerogel was Y-15.
[0:52:33 - 0:52:47] ▶
It's so ridiculous. And they, who work for him, these top level scientists have passed this around and around for decades. And then like that Bigelow comes on with George and just murders, you know, 20 years of bullshit.
[0:52:47 - 0:52:59] ▶
And it still gets ignored and it still gets ignored. They still repeat the same.
[0:52:59 - 0:53:03] ▶
Wish is a big indication that they are not listening. They are waiting. I say this all the time. When, when you're, when you're speaking with them, they're not actually listening to the data you're bringing to them. The information you're bringing.
[0:53:03 - 0:53:17] ▶
They're just listening to you and preparing their rebuttal. They're, they're, they're not actually suspending judgment and actually listening to you.
[0:53:17 - 0:53:26] ▶
They're just waiting for you to finish talking. And then they're going to say something that they cherry picked an attack with.
[0:53:26 - 0:53:31] ▶
That's what I mean, man. It's super blind. It's really weird.
[0:53:32 - 0:53:34] ▶
Like his, his birth certificate, which was, has also been blown out of proportion, but it was one of the things I looked at after we realized there's a dead end at a lot of places where there should be records and there are not in particular Los Alamos.
[0:53:34 - 0:53:47] ▶
So I, I, he told me where he'd been born and I go looking for it and ask them about a birth certificate at the hospital and they didn't have one.
[0:53:47 - 0:53:55] ▶
Well, there was Bob was adopted, right? He was born under one name and he was adopted under another name. And, and that's why it was, it was not easily findable. It was found later.
[0:53:55 - 0:54:05] ▶
Yeah. But I mean, people blow that up. Like, whoa, you really tried to pull a fast one on, on, on us there. It was just a simple error on the part of the hospital at the time.
[0:54:05 - 0:54:14] ▶
Uh, there, there are a lot of things like that.
[0:54:14 - 0:54:16] ▶
There's a lot of things like that. And, and, you know, and I, and I'll now going specific, I've said this before, but I'll say it here just for the audience that, to, to listen to.
[0:54:16 - 0:54:26] ▶
And I, I can't, I can't put enough value in, in the, in the way we went about forensically analyzing the story because we had to build it.
[0:54:26 - 0:54:38] ▶
So when you're building something, you're actually inadvertently, uh, investigating it. It's, it's kind of a, you know, if I have to build this room, I'm kind of investigating the size of it.
[0:54:38 - 0:54:50] ▶
I'm investigating the, the provenance of where the materials come from. It's, it's kind of like a second degree investigation while I'm doing work.
[0:54:50 - 0:54:58] ▶
So we built S4, we built the, the flying saucer, the sport model. And by doing so, there's things that happened that are only possible to discover if you are physically in the space.
[0:54:58 - 0:55:13] ▶
And the only way to do that is either to actually be in regards to the sport model, the actual flying saucer.
[0:55:13 - 0:55:20] ▶
If either you go inside the flying saucer for real, or you go inside a professional 3d recreation of the flying saucer, or if somebody one day wants to build it for real, they have to build it to spec, which I hope somebody does one day.
[0:55:20 - 0:55:39] ▶
Cause it'd be cool fucking tourist attractions in Las Vegas. It would be cool to go visit the sport model.
[0:55:39 - 0:55:44] ▶
Yeah. Whatever the case is. When, when Bob Lazar was explaining it to us and building the sport model took a long time.
[0:55:44 - 0:55:52] ▶
He kept insisting how dark it was in the craft. And I want to reiterate this cause it's an important thing.
[0:55:52 - 0:55:59] ▶
Every single time we talked to him, he would always say it was very dark inside the craft. Cause we were asking him a lot of stuff.
[0:55:59 - 0:56:07] ▶
And he was like, Oh, I remember that, but it was still dark. And so dark was a big, it was, it was dark.
[0:56:07 - 0:56:13] ▶
It's, it is, it's not very bright.
[0:56:13 - 0:56:15] ▶
Jack it around, but he keeps telling you that it's dark, even though you.
[0:56:15 - 0:56:17] ▶
And so that w that was something that we were okay. It must be fucking dark in that thing. Cause he keeps saying that.
[0:56:17 - 0:56:23] ▶
So at a certain point I'm asking him, so the hatchway, how did you get in? He goes, well, I had to lean down and crawl in there because of the inclination of the craft.
[0:56:23 - 0:56:32] ▶
And you know, to, if a five, 10 person is inside this inclination, you can't walk in. You have to crawl in because it's an inclined.
[0:56:32 - 0:56:42] ▶
And then you've eventually, the closer you get to the middle, the more you could stand up.
[0:56:42 - 0:56:46] ▶
And as he says, I'm crawling in, I had to move some of the extension cables.
[0:56:46 - 0:56:50] ▶
And I remember going extension cables.
[0:56:50 - 0:56:53] ▶
It hadn't, it hadn't hit me.
[0:56:54 - 0:56:57] ▶
It hadn't hit Chris on my team, which a big shout out to Chris Matto.
[0:56:57 - 0:57:01] ▶
Cause he's a magician in VFX.
[0:57:01 - 0:57:03] ▶
And we were like, what is he talking about?
[0:57:03 - 0:57:05] ▶
He goes, well, they had, they had tripod lights in there.
[0:57:05 - 0:57:08] ▶
And I thought, oh yeah.
[0:57:08 - 0:57:10] ▶
Like, how are you going to power them?
[0:57:10 - 0:57:12] ▶
You need, you need, there, there's no, there's, there's no electrical out there in the sport model.
[0:57:12 - 0:57:16] ▶
Right. So I'm like, oh shit.
[0:57:16 - 0:57:17] ▶
Yeah. There would be extension cables.
[0:57:17 - 0:57:19] ▶
And he said, yeah, but he, he said it nonchalantly.
[0:57:19 - 0:57:23] ▶
And I thought, I thought that was clear.
[0:57:23 - 0:57:25] ▶
Yeah. I thought that, and it didn't, we're building it.
[0:57:25 - 0:57:27] ▶
We didn't realize that.
[0:57:27 - 0:57:28] ▶
Anyway, we put these.
[0:57:28 - 0:57:30] ▶
We asked him what kind of tripods, what kind of lights were in there?
[0:57:30 - 0:57:34] ▶
He says they were industrial yellow with four head industrial halogens, uh, spotlights.
[0:57:34 - 0:57:39] ▶
And they were, they were, uh, you know, they, they have a telescope, a telescopic like rod.
[0:57:39 - 0:57:45] ▶
So they were pretty low because of the, the height of the interior of the sport model.
[0:57:45 - 0:57:50] ▶
And the lights were pointed upward to the ceiling of the craft.
[0:57:50 - 0:57:54] ▶
And there was two of them.
[0:57:54 - 0:57:55] ▶
That means eight super bright industrial halogen lights in there.
[0:57:55 - 0:57:59] ▶
We researched the type of lights that the U S government would buy back in the 1980s.
[0:57:59 - 0:58:04] ▶
And then the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the temperature that they, they emitted.
[0:58:04 - 0:58:13] ▶
And also obviously the craft itself.
[0:58:13 - 0:58:15] ▶
We spent a tremendous amount of time to make sure that the reflectivity of the material and the spectrum, the, the, the, the way it reflects light.
[0:58:15 - 0:58:23] ▶
And everything was accurate.
[0:58:23 - 0:58:25] ▶
So we real world physics are on, regardless of it being a 3d environment.
[0:58:25 - 0:58:31] ▶
This is what happens in physics.
[0:58:31 - 0:58:33] ▶
So we turn on the lights and now they're at the right intensity and it's dark.
[0:58:33 - 0:58:38] ▶
And Chris and I are looking at the screen and, oh, by the way, so we filmed the whole thing.
[0:58:38 - 0:58:42] ▶
The whole documentary was filmed with a black magic, 6k cameras.
[0:58:42 - 0:58:46] ▶
So we said, let's bring a black magic, 6k camera in the craft to, to replicate the, the camera, the same aperture, same everything so that it flows well in the film.
[0:58:46 - 0:58:57] ▶
And we turn on the camera and we're like, I can't see anything.
[0:58:57 - 0:59:00] ▶
And he goes, I know it's super dark.
[0:59:01 - 0:59:03] ▶
I'm like, I said, turn on the lights.
[0:59:03 - 0:59:05] ▶
And I'm like, what do you mean there?
[0:59:05 - 0:59:06] ▶
I can't see anything.
[0:59:06 - 0:59:07] ▶
You could see a little bit, but it's, it's too dark.
[0:59:07 - 0:59:09] ▶
I said, but what do you mean?
[0:59:09 - 0:59:11] ▶
He goes, they're fucking on.
[0:59:11 - 0:59:13] ▶
So I said, well, crank them up a bit.
[0:59:13 - 0:59:15] ▶
Cause he wants to make it accurate.
[0:59:16 - 0:59:18] ▶
So he goes, you sure?
[0:59:18 - 0:59:19] ▶
I'm like, well, dude, we can't see anything.
[0:59:19 - 0:59:21] ▶
So I crank up the light.
[0:59:21 - 0:59:23] ▶
Crank up the light three times.
[0:59:24 - 0:59:27] ▶
It's, it's what it's doing.
[0:59:28 - 0:59:30] ▶
It's the light is so intense on these spotlights that it, it reflect, it hits the ceiling of the sport model ceiling.
[0:59:31 - 0:59:38] ▶
But for some reason it's not reflect, reflecting.
[0:59:38 - 0:59:43] ▶
It's not reflecting the light.
[0:59:43 - 0:59:45] ▶
Like you would see in a normal, with a mirror or something.
[0:59:45 - 0:59:47] ▶
It kind of absorbs the light where it's at.
[0:59:47 - 0:59:50] ▶
I'm like, this is weird.
[0:59:50 - 0:59:52] ▶
And I said, is the material on?
[0:59:52 - 0:59:54] ▶
Is the ref everything was on.
[0:59:54 - 0:59:56] ▶
I thought this is really weird.
[0:59:56 - 0:59:59] ▶
So I, I asked him fucking crank it.
[0:59:59 - 1:00:02] ▶
Like, I mean, I want to see.
[1:00:02 - 1:00:03] ▶
So he, we went 20 times.
[1:00:03 - 1:00:06] ▶
Now you could see, not bright, but you could see.
[1:00:06 - 1:00:10] ▶
And he says, but that's not, that's not realistic.
[1:00:10 - 1:00:13] ▶
I mean, there's no light back then that could do that.
[1:00:13 - 1:00:16] ▶
Not at least not those lights.
[1:00:16 - 1:00:18] ▶
I said, but we need to film in here.
[1:00:18 - 1:00:20] ▶
And we need, we need, we need the audience to see what, what Bob's up.
[1:00:20 - 1:00:24] ▶
So I called Bob and I said, Bob, it's, it's fucking dark.
[1:00:24 - 1:00:28] ▶
Are you sure there were only two?
[1:00:28 - 1:00:30] ▶
He says, yeah, it was really dark in there.
[1:00:30 - 1:00:32] ▶
Now, if you're, if you're talking to somebody who is making it up,
[1:00:32 - 1:00:38] ▶
is making it up thing to make up a story.
[1:00:38 - 1:00:41] ▶
If that's somebody is saying to you, there's two industrial sized tripods with four halogen heads that are super powerful on each one inside this craft.
[1:00:41 - 1:00:54] ▶
Wouldn't you make up that it lit up the room?
[1:00:54 - 1:00:58] ▶
Isn't that the, the logical process?
[1:00:58 - 1:01:01] ▶
Why would you say there are fucking strong lights and yet it's dark in there?
[1:01:01 - 1:01:06] ▶
You cannot know that unless you're in there.
[1:01:06 - 1:01:11] ▶
And that was a huge tell for us.
[1:01:11 - 1:01:14] ▶
Cause we said, you have to have been in there to know that.
[1:01:14 - 1:01:18] ▶
Yeah. So that's your moment of really being like, holy.
[1:01:18 - 1:01:21] ▶
Yeah. That was a holy thought moment for me.
[1:01:21 - 1:01:23] ▶
The location of us floor.
[1:01:25 - 1:01:26] ▶
You do get into that.
[1:01:27 - 1:01:28] ▶
And, and, and did, is it really there?
[1:01:28 - 1:01:29] ▶
So that, you know, that was something that I tackled early that you tackled early.
[1:01:29 - 1:01:33] ▶
And, you know, from the very first, these Russian satellite photos that Bob and Gene had got the show, there's a road that leads down from, uh, area 51 group Lake down to where Bob said S4 was next to Papus.
[1:01:33 - 1:01:46] ▶
Why do they have that road?
[1:01:46 - 1:01:48] ▶
And nobody could really say, but everyone I asked said, there has never been a facility there.
[1:01:48 - 1:01:53] ▶
There's never been a base there.
[1:01:53 - 1:01:54] ▶
There's no program that's ever, ever been there ever.
[1:01:54 - 1:01:57] ▶
Everyone said the same thing.
[1:01:57 - 1:01:58] ▶
I did get Nellis on the phone, uh, back then.
[1:01:58 - 1:02:01] ▶
And they confirmed, uh, give us a second to, do we have an S4 on the Nellis range?
[1:02:01 - 1:02:06] ▶
Give us a second, come back.
[1:02:06 - 1:02:07] ▶
And yeah, we do have an S4.
[1:02:07 - 1:02:08] ▶
In fact, we have more than one.
[1:02:08 - 1:02:09] ▶
Can you tell me where they are?
[1:02:09 - 1:02:10] ▶
Can you tell me what goes on there?
[1:02:11 - 1:02:12] ▶
But it was on the record.
[1:02:13 - 1:02:14] ▶
We call them together.
[1:02:16 - 1:02:17] ▶
And I've got that recording.
[1:02:17 - 1:02:18] ▶
I'll share with you at some point, but, uh, yeah, there's an S4.
[1:02:18 - 1:02:21] ▶
There's more than one.
[1:02:21 - 1:02:22] ▶
We can't tell you where it is, but everyone, when you ask what's down there, nothing, zero.
[1:02:22 - 1:02:27] ▶
So, you know, we had in those days, we didn't have virtual reality tech recreate.
[1:02:27 - 1:02:32] ▶
We had a couple of drawings, very crude drawings of Bob did.
[1:02:32 - 1:02:35] ▶
And that's basically what we had to, to, to show that part of it.
[1:02:35 - 1:02:40] ▶
But you found something, uh, five years ago, a guy gets permission for God knows what reason
[1:02:40 - 1:02:46] ▶
to fly over and take photos of groom, of papoose.
[1:02:46 - 1:02:50] ▶
And I think he's not a Lazar supporter at all.
[1:02:50 - 1:02:53] ▶
He's happy to come up with photos that show, Hey, there's nothing there.
[1:02:53 - 1:02:56] ▶
And then people started taking a closer look at the photos that he made available.
[1:02:56 - 1:03:00] ▶
We put all of them on our mystery wire site on KLS and people had Adam.
[1:03:00 - 1:03:04] ▶
And looking at it, analyzing it, they saw shit.
[1:03:04 - 1:03:09] ▶
This looks like hangar doors at this place, at this area where Bob said it really did happen.
[1:03:09 - 1:03:14] ▶
And they went out three weeks in a row in 1989 in March of 89, a group of different, slightly different groups of people.
[1:03:14 - 1:03:23] ▶
And videotaped these things lifting up over the mountains at papoose, not groom at papoose where supposedly nothing exists.
[1:03:23 - 1:03:31] ▶
So you took a shot at the photos that have been made public.
[1:03:31 - 1:03:35] ▶
Tell us what you see and what you show in the film.
[1:03:35 - 1:03:37] ▶
The, the, the information that came to us was given to me by a guy called Scott Mitchell.
[1:03:37 - 1:03:43] ▶
We were in the process of making the film.
[1:03:43 - 1:03:45] ▶
I had everybody and their brother reach out to me, telling me that they knew stuff about, you know, area 51 and S4.
[1:03:45 - 1:03:50] ▶
And I was ignoring all of it.
[1:03:50 - 1:03:52] ▶
I, I, I have to say, it's my apologies to a lot of people probably who've reached out to me, but I had, I couldn't, I couldn't deal with it.
[1:03:52 - 1:03:59] ▶
I had too much stuff to do.
[1:03:59 - 1:04:00] ▶
And I thought, look, I have Bob Lazar.
[1:04:00 - 1:04:02] ▶
I'm going to focus on what I have here.
[1:04:02 - 1:04:04] ▶
And we had built, we had already built the, the, first of all, we had gone over it with Bob.
[1:04:04 - 1:04:09] ▶
We'd gone over where the hill is, where the doors were, where the entrance door was in the little crease in the hill there.
[1:04:09 - 1:04:15] ▶
Exactly where near the, the papoose lake.
[1:04:15 - 1:04:17] ▶
And where, if the doors pointed at the, at the lake, dry lake or not.
[1:04:17 - 1:04:21] ▶
And it, they didn't.
[1:04:21 - 1:04:22] ▶
So there was clearly a lot done for us to build it.
[1:04:22 - 1:04:27] ▶
We got satellite data, topography data, USGS data.
[1:04:27 - 1:04:30] ▶
And got even Russian satellite data, which we weren't allowed to get, but we, we got.
[1:04:32 - 1:04:37] ▶
And we use that to create the landscape topography.
[1:04:37 - 1:04:40] ▶
Suddenly this guy reaches out and he must've realized I'm ignoring him.
[1:04:40 - 1:04:44] ▶
So he sends me a drawing and he says, look, man, he goes, this is what I think is there.
[1:04:44 - 1:04:50] ▶
And when I saw it, I remember going, huh, that's like, that's a really accurate to where we have it.
[1:04:50 - 1:04:57] ▶
Cause I thought somebody on my team leaked something.
[1:04:59 - 1:05:01] ▶
Cause you know, our images and I'm like, what if, cause we would take a screenshot, share it with like, look at this, this, you know.
[1:05:01 - 1:05:07] ▶
And I thought that did, did somebody leak this?
[1:05:07 - 1:05:10] ▶
So I got kind of upset.
[1:05:10 - 1:05:11] ▶
Cause I'm like, how the fuck does this guy know this?
[1:05:11 - 1:05:13] ▶
So I asked everybody to say, no, are you crazy?
[1:05:13 - 1:05:15] ▶
We're not, we're not sending this out.
[1:05:15 - 1:05:17] ▶
So I reached out to him.
[1:05:17 - 1:05:18] ▶
I said, you know, what's going on?
[1:05:18 - 1:05:20] ▶
And he goes, look, I know you don't know me, but I a hundred percent think I got something here and I want to show it to you.
[1:05:20 - 1:05:27] ▶
So that day I was at Bob Lazar's house.
[1:05:27 - 1:05:31] ▶
I was at his house and he sends this to me.
[1:05:32 - 1:05:35] ▶
And I'm like, that's interesting.
[1:05:35 - 1:05:37] ▶
That's a really interesting shot there.
[1:05:37 - 1:05:39] ▶
So I, I, I, I'm standing with Bob and I go, what do you think of this?
[1:05:39 - 1:05:44] ▶
And Bob's like, holy shit.
[1:05:44 - 1:05:46] ▶
You know, is that, I go, I don't know.
[1:05:46 - 1:05:49] ▶
He goes, Bob's like, I don't know.
[1:05:50 - 1:05:52] ▶
You know, he, he's, he's very, it was very reluctant.
[1:05:52 - 1:05:55] ▶
So I FaceTime with this guy and he's, he's like, oh, and I say, look who I'm with.
[1:05:56 - 1:06:01] ▶
And he's just like, oh my God, you know?
[1:06:01 - 1:06:03] ▶
And the guy's like, look, I'm, I, I know you guys might not believe this, but you could go verify it yourself.
[1:06:03 - 1:06:09] ▶
It's, it's publicly available.
[1:06:10 - 1:06:12] ▶
I'm not going to give you anything.
[1:06:12 - 1:06:14] ▶
If you find that interesting, reach me back.
[1:06:14 - 1:06:16] ▶
This is my phone number.
[1:06:16 - 1:06:18] ▶
I said, that's a cool, cool dude.
[1:06:18 - 1:06:20] ▶
Got back to Montreal with this information.
[1:06:22 - 1:06:24] ▶
I didn't do it immediately.
[1:06:24 - 1:06:25] ▶
And I went back and I gave everybody a task and I had a lot of people on the team.
[1:06:25 - 1:06:29] ▶
I said, everybody, I want you to find this picture.
[1:06:29 - 1:06:31] ▶
Number one, find it.
[1:06:31 - 1:06:33] ▶
Find it on your own.
[1:06:33 - 1:06:34] ▶
Don't make me give it to you.
[1:06:34 - 1:06:35] ▶
And that's what they did.
[1:06:36 - 1:06:37] ▶
Now replicate it on your own.
[1:06:39 - 1:06:42] ▶
I'm not going to even tell you, but they knew where the hanger doors are supposed to be.
[1:06:43 - 1:06:48] ▶
I said, figure it out.
[1:06:48 - 1:06:50] ▶
And the first one who figures it out, call me.
[1:06:50 - 1:06:52] ▶
It didn't take more than 15 minutes.
[1:06:52 - 1:06:54] ▶
It was Chris on my team.
[1:06:54 - 1:06:56] ▶
He goes, come and see me, dude.
[1:06:56 - 1:06:58] ▶
What do you have to do to it, to that photo to make it appear?
[1:06:58 - 1:07:01] ▶
Now, there are multiple different software somebody could use to do this.
[1:07:01 - 1:07:05] ▶
A lot of people will immediately jump to, I don't know, Photoshop, because that's the most popular one.
[1:07:05 - 1:07:10] ▶
We did it in DaVinci Resolve.
[1:07:10 - 1:07:12] ▶
There are a bunch of toggles and a bunch of, let's say, settings that you could do that will show you different aspects of an image.
[1:07:12 - 1:07:20] ▶
This is what forensic analysis of a picture is.
[1:07:20 - 1:07:23] ▶
So whether you're forensically analyzing a picture of a desert or you're forensically analyzing a building, whatever it is, there's ways to forensically analyze the data inside an image.
[1:07:23 - 1:07:36] ▶
And he said, I got it.
[1:07:36 - 1:07:39] ▶
And so we went and he's got a big screen and you could see it on a big screen.
[1:07:40 - 1:07:43] ▶
And I'm like, oh, wow, it's there.
[1:07:43 - 1:07:45] ▶
I go, is that the image you found?
[1:07:45 - 1:07:48] ▶
And then Veronica on my team, she turns around and says, I got it too.
[1:07:49 - 1:07:54] ▶
And she was using Photoshop.
[1:07:54 - 1:07:55] ▶
So on two separate softwares, she got hers was not as clear as the one that we were able to get through DaVinci, but it was there.
[1:07:55 - 1:08:03] ▶
So it's not a software that creates lines.
[1:08:03 - 1:08:07] ▶
No, it reveals them.
[1:08:08 - 1:08:10] ▶
All you're doing, all you're doing is you are simply, you're never touching the image.
[1:08:10 - 1:08:16] ▶
You're just changing the features of the image.
[1:08:16 - 1:08:20] ▶
You're highlighting contrast.
[1:08:20 - 1:08:22] ▶
You're highlighting all sorts of different elements in the image.
[1:08:22 - 1:08:25] ▶
We have a raw data image.
[1:08:25 - 1:08:27] ▶
And we, once we found it, we said, make sure that the entire image, because it's, you know, it's a small part.
[1:08:27 - 1:08:36] ▶
Is it maybe the noise in the image?
[1:08:37 - 1:08:40] ▶
Is it possible that the camera is replicating this elsewhere?
[1:08:40 - 1:08:44] ▶
What if you would sell more on track?
[1:08:46 - 1:08:47] ▶
So we verified the whole image and there's nothing like that.
[1:08:47 - 1:08:50] ▶
Then we asked, go to the previous images, because the photographer didn't just take one shot.
[1:08:51 - 1:08:58] ▶
He was like, click, click, click while the plane is going click, click.
[1:08:59 - 1:09:01] ▶
So there's a variety of shots.
[1:09:01 - 1:09:03] ▶
And I said, go to the two previous and go to the two following and try to replicate.
[1:09:03 - 1:09:08] ▶
And they're all there.
[1:09:08 - 1:09:09] ▶
They thought it was there.
[1:09:09 - 1:09:10] ▶
They thought it would debunk Lazar.
[1:09:10 - 1:09:12] ▶
And he'd see exactly what he said.
[1:09:13 - 1:09:15] ▶
So when, when I read the comments, when the film came out and nobody, a lot of people who were commenting, obviously the trip, the, the, the naysayers were, were taking a photo of their TV and put of the original image and putting it on their X account going, look, there's nothing there.
[1:09:15 - 1:09:32] ▶
I'm like, what, what are you doing?
[1:09:34 - 1:09:35] ▶
Like, you're not even, you're not even going step two.
[1:09:35 - 1:09:38] ▶
You're going step one.
[1:09:38 - 1:09:39] ▶
Of course there's nothing there.
[1:09:39 - 1:09:40] ▶
But the whole point is we, you have to, for.
[1:09:40 - 1:09:42] ▶
It was built to look like it is the desert.
[1:09:42 - 1:09:44] ▶
It's made to be disguised.
[1:09:45 - 1:09:46] ▶
It's made to be disguised.
[1:09:46 - 1:09:47] ▶
So when you actually do the work and you actually honestly report on what the work provides you as a result, you can't deny there is a geometric pattern in that hill that from that distance looks like large rectangular formations.
[1:09:47 - 1:10:07] ▶
The first one being slightly wider than the eight other ones, believe it or not, there's nine.
[1:10:07 - 1:10:14] ▶
And Bob said the first hanger was called the big hanger.
[1:10:14 - 1:10:18] ▶
I mean, is that not something to take into consideration or what?
[1:10:19 - 1:10:24] ▶
I mean, if that, if you've already written them off, then the answer is no.
[1:10:24 - 1:10:27] ▶
And people don't want to know.
[1:10:27 - 1:10:28] ▶
And as I say in my film, and I'll say it again.
[1:10:28 - 1:10:31] ▶
Now that does not provide evidence to flying saucers at all.
[1:10:31 - 1:10:36] ▶
And I'm saying this right now.
[1:10:37 - 1:10:38] ▶
I did not put that in the film to prove that that proved flying saucers.
[1:10:38 - 1:10:42] ▶
What it does though, is in 1989, Bob Lazar knew that at that exact location, near Papus Lake, there was something hidden in the mountain that looked like large rectangular doors.
[1:10:42 - 1:10:57] ▶
How did he know that?
[1:10:57 - 1:10:59] ▶
How did he know there were flights on Wednesday nights that were videotaped?
[1:11:00 - 1:11:03] ▶
I saw Michael Shermer put out a list of lies that Bob is told that he'd be asked about.
[1:11:03 - 1:11:09] ▶
And the last one is he says something to the effect of, well, look, we know that there are legitimate national security programs that were carried out in that location.
[1:11:09 - 1:11:17] ▶
How do you know it's flying saucers?
[1:11:17 - 1:11:18] ▶
Wait, what programs?
[1:11:18 - 1:11:19] ▶
Because everyone is over and associated with Groom Lake has said there was nothing ever there.
[1:11:22 - 1:11:26] ▶
What programs were flying glowing discs over Papus Lake?
[1:11:26 - 1:11:30] ▶
And how did Bob know?
[1:11:31 - 1:11:32] ▶
Oh, probably because he was there and saw it.
[1:11:33 - 1:11:35] ▶
You know, it's crazy, man.
[1:11:38 - 1:11:40] ▶
So there's just a preponderance of evidence that keeps adding to the Bob Lazar story.
[1:11:42 - 1:11:46] ▶
Again, everybody wants, what everybody wants is a 4K picture delivered like an emperor on a gold platter of a flying saucer that with somebody that they believe is authority.
[1:11:47 - 1:12:00] ▶
Maybe the president, the pope, I don't know who saying this is real.
[1:12:00 - 1:12:04] ▶
And a pile of alien bodies who were shot while trying to fight with it.
[1:12:04 - 1:12:07] ▶
And even then, I think they would find a way to say that's bullshit.
[1:12:08 - 1:12:11] ▶
Let's talk about that.
[1:12:11 - 1:12:12] ▶
So, you know, interestingly enough, for many decades, Lazar has been describing the way these craft propel and the way that they can be kind of the visuals can be distorted because of the propulsion systems.
[1:12:12 - 1:12:24] ▶
You know, he's been talking about how the craft back in the day, it sounded absurd when he said it went belly first.
[1:12:24 - 1:12:30] ▶
That the sport model would turn at high propulsion mode and shoot off.
[1:12:31 - 1:12:35] ▶
But then we see the gimbal UFO come up and it does a rotation, which is not aerodynamic.
[1:12:35 - 1:12:41] ▶
And people are like, huh, that's exactly like Bob's been describing all these years.
[1:12:41 - 1:12:45] ▶
You know, also George and I released maybe a month ago.
[1:12:45 - 1:12:48] ▶
Now, I don't remember exactly how long the first time people have had visual evidence of military film designated UAP by them in an analysis done by our own intelligence agencies saying this is an example of instantaneous acceleration.
[1:12:48 - 1:13:02] ▶
There are five observables associated with UAP.
[1:13:02 - 1:13:05] ▶
The first one is instantaneous acceleration.
[1:13:05 - 1:13:08] ▶
But the world has never seen an example of this where physicists can look at the footage.
[1:13:08 - 1:13:12] ▶
They can forensically analyze the footage.
[1:13:12 - 1:13:15] ▶
So you're talking about what people want.
[1:13:15 - 1:13:17] ▶
We've done our best over the years to obtain and release the best visual evidence that we can find or have had access to in some way or thrown at us.
[1:13:17 - 1:13:28] ▶
So there you go. We've done our best.
[1:13:28 - 1:13:31] ▶
The last one was a banger.
[1:13:31 - 1:13:33] ▶
And I think it's important that people re-look at this.
[1:13:33 - 1:13:36] ▶
And maybe it went under the radar because people are so now they're like, oh, my God, another UFO video.
[1:13:36 - 1:13:40] ▶
Motherfucker, it's hard to get these out.
[1:13:40 - 1:13:42] ▶
And this one and it's a lot of risk, too.
[1:13:42 - 1:13:45] ▶
You want to make sure you're not in danger of national security, that you protect sources, especially when they don't pick up.
[1:13:45 - 1:13:49] ▶
They're not being fooled.
[1:13:49 - 1:13:50] ▶
They're not being fooled.
[1:13:50 - 1:13:51] ▶
They're not being fooled. It's a big one for us.
[1:13:51 - 1:13:52] ▶
We get given a lot of time stuff.
[1:13:52 - 1:13:53] ▶
99% don't go out because it's either dangerous or they're trying to fool us.
[1:13:53 - 1:13:59] ▶
But this I still stand behind.
[1:13:59 - 1:14:01] ▶
Now, interestingly enough, if you look at this list, it was sent to the Secretary of Defense Department of War, Pete Hegseth.
[1:14:01 - 1:14:11] ▶
And this is by Rep Luna and our friends Rep Burleson, Rep Burchett.
[1:14:11 - 1:14:15] ▶
And in here, they ask for 46 different videos by name of UAP that are on servers, you know, really sensitive servers.
[1:14:15 - 1:14:24] ▶
I didn't get that list, Jeremy.
[1:14:24 - 1:14:25] ▶
Do you have any thoughts on that?
[1:14:25 - 1:14:27] ▶
We can talk about it some other time.
[1:14:27 - 1:14:29] ▶
I think it is no surprise to people that we have been working with Congress to make sure that they get the best of the best.
[1:14:29 - 1:14:36] ▶
We know for a fact they do, George and I.
[1:14:38 - 1:14:40] ▶
In fact, we've seen, if not all, most of them.
[1:14:40 - 1:14:43] ▶
Now, the second one on the list we put out, Syria UAP Instant Acceleration 2021.
[1:14:43 - 1:14:49] ▶
What makes me excited, you talk about evidence and talk about authority coming forward.
[1:14:49 - 1:14:53] ▶
Here's an opportunity.
[1:14:53 - 1:14:54] ▶
Here's an opportunity to give the world this data.
[1:14:54 - 1:14:57] ▶
Most of these videos, there's nothing wrong with it being whatever they need to do to get it out.
[1:14:57 - 1:15:02] ▶
Declassify whatever they say.
[1:15:02 - 1:15:04] ▶
These videos will not hurt America.
[1:15:04 - 1:15:07] ▶
Maybe there's one or two that shouldn't come out.
[1:15:07 - 1:15:09] ▶
This whole list can come out.
[1:15:09 - 1:15:10] ▶
And I suspect you're going to see a lot of videos if they don't cough it up.
[1:15:10 - 1:15:15] ▶
And so I really see this as an opportunity to show the world the best evidence that they have.
[1:15:15 - 1:15:20] ▶
And this isn't even the best evidence.
[1:15:20 - 1:15:21] ▶
Maybe if we gave them 13 videos from the Air Force by name, we just gave them the names of them and which servers to go look at.
[1:15:22 - 1:15:28] ▶
They didn't print those.
[1:15:28 - 1:15:29] ▶
But if they just released these, because they just did that, you'd have that, Luigi.
[1:15:29 - 1:15:33] ▶
The best video evidence that's probably accessible if Congress gets lucky and really keeps on pressing the issue.
[1:15:33 - 1:15:39] ▶
They know where they are and they're now monitoring it to make sure it suddenly doesn't disappear off the face.
[1:15:39 - 1:15:45] ▶
So that's supposed to happen probably the day we release this episode somewhere around there.
[1:15:45 - 1:15:50] ▶
If this is, you know, we release it.
[1:15:50 - 1:15:51] ▶
I think right around that day they have an opportunity to give the American public bangers, just amazing UAP footage that they designate a UAP that show observables.
[1:15:51 - 1:16:02] ▶
And if they don't do it, I suspect that journalism will do their job.
[1:16:02 - 1:16:06] ▶
Well, that's going to be interesting.
[1:16:06 - 1:16:08] ▶
That's going to be really interesting.
[1:16:09 - 1:16:10] ▶
Because we get more data, man.
[1:16:10 - 1:16:11] ▶
And then with that more data, people much smarter than us can analyze it.
[1:16:11 - 1:16:15] ▶
Well, that's, that's, I love that because that's what I always say.
[1:16:15 - 1:16:19] ▶
Bring it out and have smart, unbiased people forensically analyzing.
[1:16:19 - 1:16:25] ▶
Don't, don't go at it with the, this is bullshit.
[1:16:25 - 1:16:28] ▶
Go at it with, let's see what this is.
[1:16:28 - 1:16:30] ▶
Well, our government has already put these in UAP category.
[1:16:31 - 1:16:33] ▶
These 46 or most of them are already in the UAP category.
[1:16:33 - 1:16:36] ▶
They've been analyzed.
[1:16:36 - 1:16:37] ▶
They've looked at them.
[1:16:37 - 1:16:38] ▶
They call them UAPs.
[1:16:38 - 1:16:39] ▶
They cannot explain them.
[1:16:39 - 1:16:41] ▶
So appreciate your time.
[1:16:41 - 1:16:43] ▶
We could, we could go on for four.
[1:16:43 - 1:16:44] ▶
Appreciate you guys.
[1:16:44 - 1:16:45] ▶
But I do want to give you our condolences on your death.
[1:16:46 - 1:16:48] ▶
Apparently it's, it's going around that I am, I passed away.
[1:16:51 - 1:16:53] ▶
And that just came out.
[1:16:56 - 1:16:57] ▶
You get a, we didn't know like a wallpaper.
[1:17:00 - 1:17:02] ▶
Well, you know, you have our condolences.
[1:17:04 - 1:17:05] ▶
It was your, it was way before your time.
[1:17:05 - 1:17:07] ▶
Well, I just two things.
[1:17:08 - 1:17:09] ▶
One is, you know, our weaponized audience, when we first start weaponized, you know,
[1:17:09 - 1:17:12] ▶
they say, are you know, obviously George is going to have Bob on the show and I will confirm
[1:17:12 - 1:17:17] ▶
that's going to happen.
[1:17:17 - 1:17:18] ▶
But right now we want to see.
[1:17:18 - 1:17:20] ▶
We, it's going to happen.
[1:17:23 - 1:17:24] ▶
The legs of your film, Luigi, it's gone everywhere.
[1:17:24 - 1:17:26] ▶
This is just the start your movie.
[1:17:27 - 1:17:29] ▶
Cause you got this whole app.
[1:17:29 - 1:17:30] ▶
I'm excited to how you've revitalized everybody's interest at a critical time when real videos
[1:17:30 - 1:17:35] ▶
Um, what, what's next for you?
[1:17:36 - 1:17:38] ▶
Like what, you know, I know for me, I'm not going to be making any movies right now.
[1:17:38 - 1:17:42] ▶
I just, I, but you said you might be making new ones.
[1:17:42 - 1:17:45] ▶
So what's your future like with the UAP topic after you get through this?
[1:17:45 - 1:17:49] ▶
Well, I think I, after I get through the film, this is the first step.
[1:17:49 - 1:17:53] ▶
The second step of that, we always said, we're going to launch the VR experience.
[1:17:53 - 1:17:56] ▶
And that's actually going to be called S for the experience.
[1:17:57 - 1:17:59] ▶
So that'll be probably early fall, 2026.
[1:17:59 - 1:18:02] ▶
We're going to launch that people could go at S for themselves and walk around, turn lights
[1:18:02 - 1:18:07] ▶
on and off and do whatever they want.
[1:18:07 - 1:18:09] ▶
After that, there'll be a book.
[1:18:09 - 1:18:11] ▶
We're going to be making a really beautiful collector visual book on S for.
[1:18:11 - 1:18:16] ▶
So there's going to be some nice images.
[1:18:16 - 1:18:18] ▶
So that's kind of like all in the works of happening.
[1:18:18 - 1:18:20] ▶
So we finally get the model, we get the model at the end.
[1:18:23 - 1:18:26] ▶
It kind of all flipped on us.
[1:18:26 - 1:18:27] ▶
And so the model is the last part of it.
[1:18:27 - 1:18:29] ▶
I was going to model, man.
[1:18:30 - 1:18:31] ▶
And, uh, I think, I think if all goes well and I'm able to recoup some of my investment
[1:18:31 - 1:18:37] ▶
and that everybody in the team recoups a little bit from all this hard work, uh, our next film is clearly going to be something that I personally hold near and dear to my heart.
[1:18:37 - 1:18:48] ▶
And I think that if all goes well, I want to recreate from the perspective of all witnesses, the aerial school incident.
[1:18:48 - 1:18:56] ▶
So that is something that I'm already in talks with some of the students that were there.
[1:18:57 - 1:19:02] ▶
And, uh, I was very close to Emily trim, who was the student.
[1:19:02 - 1:19:05] ▶
She passed away a year and a half ago.
[1:19:05 - 1:19:07] ▶
And I can, for me, it's kind of like an homage to Emily because I spent 10 years with her.
[1:19:07 - 1:19:13] ▶
And, uh, I think it, it's one of the most credible stories of contact with some entities and all the kids.
[1:19:13 - 1:19:22] ▶
I mean, everybody who's still alive who were there were messerios.
[1:19:22 - 1:19:26] ▶
So you got the movie bug, man.
[1:19:28 - 1:19:29] ▶
Um, I got the movie bug.
[1:19:29 - 1:19:30] ▶
I hope it, it, it doesn't cause me the same amount of trouble as the first one or money or money.
[1:19:30 - 1:19:35] ▶
I think I learned a lot of things.
[1:19:36 - 1:19:37] ▶
So I think I know how to kind of accelerate the process more and, and spend less money on it.
[1:19:37 - 1:19:42] ▶
And there were people that you ran into who really did not want this.
[1:19:43 - 1:19:45] ▶
That could be our next time you come back.
[1:19:48 - 1:19:49] ▶
We'll have to do another one at some point, but yeah, man, I think your movie, you know,
[1:19:50 - 1:19:54] ▶
kind of pushing the envelope and people being able to see it.
[1:19:54 - 1:19:57] ▶
I'm proud of Bob too, because I know this shit's uncomfortable for him.
[1:19:57 - 1:20:00] ▶
I mean, from you, you know, kind of bring him on the news first time to all the way up to today, man.
[1:20:00 - 1:20:05] ▶
I know it's never been comfortable for him.
[1:20:05 - 1:20:07] ▶
Cause he knows what's going to happen every time he pops his head up, he gets hammered.
[1:20:08 - 1:20:11] ▶
But at least he's got more, you know, friends now and more people that are really at least considering his words.
[1:20:12 - 1:20:18] ▶
And I think that was always his point.
[1:20:18 - 1:20:19] ▶
He goes, you don't have to believe me.
[1:20:19 - 1:20:20] ▶
Just don't discount me or make up lies.
[1:20:20 - 1:20:22] ▶
So I think we're at a place now where people are accepting that on a bigger scale.
[1:20:23 - 1:20:26] ▶
And I think that's really good.
[1:20:26 - 1:20:27] ▶
I think it's really good.
[1:20:27 - 1:20:28] ▶
My beliefs are material things.
[1:20:32 - 1:20:34] ▶
I know, Lou, when you call me, there's got to be a reason.
[1:20:37 - 1:20:41] ▶
How are you, brother?
[1:20:42 - 1:20:43] ▶
George and I are working at this cool hotel, just doing some filming.
[1:20:44 - 1:20:48] ▶
Episode 115, actually.
[1:20:48 - 1:20:51] ▶
You guys are killing it with the weaponized podcast.
[1:20:51 - 1:20:53] ▶
I think it's fantastic what you guys are doing.
[1:20:54 - 1:20:57] ▶
Am I going to see you in LA, by chance?
[1:20:59 - 1:21:01] ▶
Oh, you mean to get on stage with you and have an awesome conversation in front of a
[1:21:01 - 1:21:06] ▶
How the fuck would I miss that, man?
[1:21:07 - 1:21:09] ▶
With the one and only Jeremy Corbell, dude.
[1:21:11 - 1:21:15] ▶
But, you know, sometimes, Lou, you got to bring a little surprise in.
[1:21:17 - 1:21:20] ▶
And I can't confirm nor deny, but I got a sense that, you know, somebody that we like
[1:21:20 - 1:21:25] ▶
talking with, we might be able to get this guy's eat.
[1:21:25 - 1:21:27] ▶
There's some dude back here.
[1:21:28 - 1:21:30] ▶
We interrupt this program to bring you a special report.
[1:21:30 - 1:21:33] ▶
I'm pretty sure you're pentru up.
[1:21:34 - 1:21:35] ▶
I'm pretty sure you're going to see my son, but I may be happy.
[1:21:35 - 1:21:36] ▶
I'm pretty sure you don't like it.
[1:21:36 - 1:21:37] ▶
I'm just a little bit off the line.
[1:21:37 - 1:21:38] ▶
And I'll tell you about it.
[1:21:38 - 1:21:40] ▶