Transcript: Missing UFO General 911 Call Raises Chilling Questions

Woman calls, says her husband, this former major general, walked out of the house hours ago, no phone, no glasses, apparently changed his clothes, and she says he planned not to have been found.

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I mean, honestly, what goes through your head about that?

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How do you even start the investigation?

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And by the way, how does the wife know this, right?

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That's key, right?

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What about his routine?

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What about did she know about him, says that this is a situation that he may have taken active steps to not be found.

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So to help answer all of this, to get reaction to this, to figure out where this investigation goes from here, we're bringing in somebody who has been doing this work for decades.

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Chris Madonna is Director of Law Enforcement Relations and an investigative consultant with the Cold Case Foundation.

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Chris, so good to see you.

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Thanks for taking the time.

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Thank you, Jesse.

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Appreciate the invitation, bud.

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Will you tell me what stands out to you the most about that call?

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Well, right away, I mean, the first red flag with inside that phone call is just that comment.

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You know, he must have a plan or something to that effect.

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And, you know, that's kind of one of these anomalies, right?

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What we would call DLR doesn't look right or doesn't sound right.

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And not that it couldn't be right.

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It's that would be like the first step off point when the first officer gets on the scene to start looking into this thing.

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The idea that he not, you know, she didn't say someone must have taken him, someone must have done something to him.

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There was this acknowledgement that based on the man she knows, and particularly about the clothing and the items left behind, that he did this, that he didn't want to be found.

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You know, you compare it to the Nancy Guthrie case, which is obviously different, but there wasn't an indication, well, maybe initially that we weren't entirely sure what happened.

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But it was pretty clear this wasn't a wandering off situation.

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You know, and yes, she's much older than McCaslin.

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But the idea that he must have planned not to be found is very, very interesting.

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Yeah, I mean, because who's introducing that plan, right?

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We hear it very first on the 911 call.

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He planned not to be found.

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Well, all right.

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When the first deputy gets on the scene and they start, you know, they have a couple of priorities.

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The first priority is to see if there's any suspicious activity in relationship to how the environment looks.

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Okay, then the second activity there that's going on simultaneously is you're interviewing witnesses, and in this case, the family, the wife, and you want to lock them into a statement so that, you know, later on when the investigators get on scene, and if it didn't sound right or it doesn't look right, like we were talking a moment ago, then, you know, you tell that to your first responding investigators.

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And the third piece of that puzzle is you've got to start looking through the house, and you have to start looking through the anomalies that she may have been talking about on the phone, i.e. she has a lot of guns, he's been going through a lot of mental stuff, we went to the same doctor, etc.

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And you want to start looking for evidence that will correlate to the truthfulness of potentially that statement.

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So in this case, it is critical and would have been critical right from the very moment that first deputy got on scene.

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And then the Cozzi in the same day, and then the Cozzi were.

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Right, I think so.

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So I think that was a big indication, right?

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You know, the idea that the Cozzi was in.

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So it, does it become almost impossible to know what he was wearing then?

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I mean, do you, how do you know the whole wardrobe collection of a human being, even if you're married to them?

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And also, unless they purchased clothes beforehand that they hadn't worn before, that seems like a challenge in and of itself.

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Yeah, right. And this is why you don't go into these investigations asking the word how,

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but always asking the word why. Why would he have left the items behind like his cell phone,

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his prescription glasses, all the wearables, right? The things that you're going to need

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out there in the world. And so you have to start breaking that down. And then you have to start

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plugging those gaps of really gumshoe investigative techniques. I mean, the strongest tool for any

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surgeon is a scalpel. But for an investigator, it's the question. So the very first type of

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questions that are put out to the witnesses slash even the wife and the family, those are going to

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tell you the wounds potentially with inside this investigation. And you're going to be able to

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figure out, okay, how do I need to stitch these wounds up? Where investigators get screwed up

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is they write the prescription without doing the diagnosis. And so sometimes, you know, if somebody

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was, you know, if there's foul play here, well, the suspect has the advantage in that situation.

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And, you know, some of the red flags that even like you're talking about there jump right out the he

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missing hiking boots, you know, the gun, etc. But where's all of this coming from? It's coming from

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the inside of his home, i.e. through the witnesses that last saw him. And so you want to make sure

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that you're cutting through that pretty quickly with the right type of questioning and interviewing

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techniques. And I wonder if there's a complication that this is not just John Smith who disappears,

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but this is somebody who has training. This is somebody who's an outdoorsman. And you wonder if

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this is the case where they don't want to be found. Is it likely they won't be found?

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Well, you know, that's always a possibility, right? I mean, with his military training,

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the question is, if he's wandering away from his house, you have to now do what they call a

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geographical profile and say, okay, you know, how far would this guy get? He's 68 years old,

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may have some upcoming health issues, but he's also healthy, based on what, you know, his wife is

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saying. He doesn't have any dementia issues, per se. So immediately, you'd want to talk to his

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doctors. You'd want to talk to the last people that saw him and try to tighten up that timeline.

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And then simultaneously, if he doesn't want to be found, then you want to start looking for a digital

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footprint in today's environment.

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I just want to go back to the mental health aspect of it, right? I think that's really a

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concerning, chilling part of it, the lack of sleep, short-term memory loss, anxiety. If my brain and

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body keeps deteriorating, a question of whether or not he wants to live like that. One of the challenges

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is if we are dealing with a situation, somebody did something to themselves, how on earth is it

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possible that with all of these agencies looking for him, that he still can't be found? That's why

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there are others who believe, was he apprehended? Was he taken? Or again, you go back to the idea you

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said, how can someone just disappear? But that's the part that's challenging, right? Even if somebody

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did something to themselves, where are they? Where's their body?

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Well, you know, this is a really interesting case. And where I used to work in San Diego County,

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we had a case in Rancho Santa Fe, it was called, his name was Ian Spiro. I don't know if you've ever

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heard of that name, but he lived in a very wealthy neighborhood. His family, four members of his family,

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his three children and his wife were found deceased in his house. And then he was later found,

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you know, in I believe it was the Borrego desert in his vehicle and he had drank some cyanide.

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And everybody didn't know who he was at the time. But, you know, just fast forward here

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and the correlations is he ended up being some high level government

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operative where he was a gun dealer, etc, etc. And to this day, that case still has not been solved.

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And this has the smell of something like that, where, you know, you have this high level government

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guy who just, you know, decides, hey, I'm just going to walk away from my house. They find a

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potential piece of clothing, you know, a couple of miles away. But to your point, he's just evaporated.

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Now, people can do that. But there's also, to your point, all these other conspiracies coming up here.

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And you have to ask yourself, okay, well, what's going on in that house first? And you don't leave

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that environment because in this case, he's a very low risk victim, meaning his environment,

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he's at his house, his situation, he's at his house, his circumstance, it's early in the morning,

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that puts him way down on the low risk thing. So there's a higher probability that he was either

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targeted by somebody he knew or somebody that had access to his environment.

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And that window, that window, the sheriff's office releases the timeline, repairman at 10 a.m.,

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wife leaves 1110, she's back 1204. It's such a narrow window. And you wonder how investigators,

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you know, work a timeline like that. And the sheriff's office, by the way,

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has been pretty open about how unusual all this is. Here's how they put it.

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His wearable devices and taking his phone were common practice with him. That is out of the

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mind. We said from the get-go that this was an abnormal behavior by his part. And thus,

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we are looking at every possible aspect of it and willing to unturn any stone that we can in order

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to help identify where Mr. McCaslin is. And apparently, they searched hard drones,

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helicopters, canine units, cadaver dogs. Grid searched the canyon where his wearable devices

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showed he hiked. And here's the thing. They later found the green shirt and the hiking boots that

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they thought he left in. This was at the family's second home in Pagosa Springs, Colorado. So they

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don't actually know what he was wearing. And by the way, the sheriff's office addressed that too.

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We've received a lot of tips about items that have been located. We check every one of them.

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We check with family and friends to see if those are items that were known to be utilized by him

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or owned by him. And we'll continue to do that. So that's the update on these items that you are

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seeing being brought forward. We're not saying he left in them. They are just unaccounted for.

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So, Chris, you're hearing the response from law enforcement. It's been a while now.

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Where do you think they are at at the investigation?

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Well, hopefully they're in a situation where they're starting to look at that digital footprint

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if it exists. If, in fact, those items are connected to this particular disappearance

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and they're found at a different location, that means you potentially have two crime scenes here.

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And so now you have to connect those dots, right? How do we get from point A to point B?

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And then, you know, from there, you have to work it backwards. Did he have a plan? I mean,

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let's say this was an intentional walk away. What was part of that plan? Well, if it's a rental car

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or if it's some type of vehicle that would be utilized to get to that second location,

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then that information is going to be available to law enforcement. They're eventually going to find that.

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But if there's, let's say, another situation where he runs into somebody, you know, who has,

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you know, bad intent, for lack of a better term. I've had a kidnapping case where a mother left a pot

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of potatoes on the store and she went to the local grocery store and she vanished. And we found her

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four months later, she was buried. And we also discovered that she, the suspects that she ran

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into were at the grocery store and it was a kidnapping for robbery. And so if this is a

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situation where, let's say he goes out and then he runs into somebody, we don't know if that,

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if that's a possibility that could have taken him to a secondary location and said, okay,

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we're going to go from here. Yeah. Or he wanted to meet with somebody. We just don't know because

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again, it's such a narrow window when he left, very, when he was, went missing. I mean,

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goes missing right after the wife leaves. Those items are left. It's difficult to know one way or

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another. And then there's the gun, by the way. So this 38 caliber revolver, the leather holster is

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still missing. Sheriff's office was asked if he normally carried it. Take a look.

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He wouldn't commonly hike with a weapon on him that would be relegated for maybe overnight camping

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trips and things of that sort. And then it was for personal protection. So what are we looking for

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with that? Well, if say General McCaslin had recently gone to a pawn shop and sold that off,

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and we just weren't aware of that, or his wife wasn't aware of that, we'd want to know that. And so

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that would be something that would be of interest. If someone is hiking in the mountains and finds

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a spent 38 special casing, that would be unique that we'd want to be able to take and process.

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So that's why we're putting that information out. Yeah. Chris, real quick. I mean, that's a really

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smart police work to try to figure out how the gun could be connected, but I haven't heard any

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updates about it. So I wonder if that's a dead end now. It could be, Jesse. It actually could.

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And the anomaly there is he took it with a holster. Okay. If you're going to, you know,

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typically with somebody who's going to do self-harm, for lack of a better term, why do you need the

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holster? Okay. I mean, I've seen so many death scenes that if somebody is going to take care of

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business, i.e. they're going to hurt themselves, they're just going to tuck that weapon right in,

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you know, potentially into their pants or carry it or whatever.

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I would challenge and say maybe it was, maybe again, if we're talking about him taking it,

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custom. I mean, it was his, it's process. He always kept it in the holster, let's say.

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And maybe, I don't know what distance he might've traveled. It would have been whatever alleged plan

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he had or whatever he wanted to do. You know, it would have been more secure to have it in the

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holster before he decided to use it or if he needed to use it.

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Right. And, and I wouldn't disagree with that at all, but at the same time,

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he's going to go to a location where they're going to find his body and they haven't discovered that

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at this point. So it's almost like these items are mentioned to create this confusion.

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And that's, I guess, where I'm going there in that thought process. It's like, there's too many

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little details that do not make sense. You know, the, the boots, you know, the wallet,

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all the stuff that he left behind, but he takes his gun and it's like, well, wait a minute, that,

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that, that's not lining up.

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There's another layer to this story that a lot of people just can't stop talking about.

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I want to get your take on it because McCaslin apparently isn't the only person in his orbit

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who's disappeared or died under strange circumstances. There is Melissa Cassius worked

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as an administrative assistant at Los Alamos National Laboratory. This is the same lab that

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developed the atomic bomb. She vanished in June of 2025, walked away from her car, left her phone,

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wallet, keys behind, last seen on camera, walking alone on a highway, gone. There's Monica Reza,

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a NASA rocket scientist, disappeared while hiking with friends in California just four days before

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Cassius vanished. She worked on a project funded by the Air Force Research Laboratory, the same lab

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that McCaslin used to oversee. And then there's Carl Grillmayer, renowned astrophysicist, shot dead at

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his home in California in February, right around the time that McCaslin went missing. His shooter was

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arrested, worked on telescope projects that were powered by military technology that was monitored by

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that same lab. And to be clear, I'm not saying all this is connected. Correlation is not causation,

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but do you see a disturbing pattern here? Do you think this should all be investigated?

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Absolutely. I mean, with those types of connections, right? Who's in a circle of influence?

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And now, you know, all these other individuals have also, you know, disappeared. And it's interesting,

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look at the correlations in relationship to hiking, okay? And just people outdoors, all of these events

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occurring outdoors. If, you know, that end of itself is suspicious, you know, what are the odds of,

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you know, a team working together? And this explains, and then disappearing together,

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and this explains why the FBI is involved in this. And it's not just a local issue from the Sheriff's

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Department. That was one of the things that jumped out right away to me. It's like, why are the feds

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involved in this? Yeah, the guy's retired military. I mean, my father was in the Marine Corps for 31 years,

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okay? But if he went, if he disappeared, the federal FBI wouldn't become knocking on my door,

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okay? And so there's a real, you know, challenge there when we see them involved. And maybe it's

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to your point, because there potentially could be a correlation. Former FBI Assistant Director

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Chris Swecker told the Daily Mail that investigators just can't look at these cases in isolation. He

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said, quote, the FBI can't have these examined in isolation and compartmentalize them as individual

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missing person cases. You have Congressman Eric Burleson also called for the FBI to get involved.

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He said the disappearances are deeply concerning. And then I want to go to this other aspect,

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the UFO angle, because McCaslin's name shows up in those hacked WikiLeaks emails. Tom DeLonge talking

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about him as the guy who ran the lab at Wright-Patterson, same place that Roswell debris supposedly

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went, Tom DeLonge from Blink-182. Sheriff's Office was asked about this. Their answer was basically,

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just because it's crazy doesn't mean it's not true, but we can't investigate that. And I've asked a

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bunch of guests that I've talked to about this. How far can they go in terms of looking at his past

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and looking at his history and looking at what he was working on? Because I imagine there's issues of

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security clearance and classified documents. Talk to me about that.

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Well, they can't go very far. Even the feds can't go very far, the FBI, unless there's what they call

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green card security clearances. And the fact that all of these things are compartmentalized, i.e.,

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you know, some of these projects may have been top secret, etc., etc., you know, you can get close to the

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door, but that doesn't mean that door is going to open. And that was one of the interesting things with

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the Ian Spiro case that I was talking about. The news got as close as, yes, there was some

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government connections, i.e., he was potentially looked at as one of the arms dealers during the

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Iran-Contra gun supply. And so once it got to that level, that's as far as it went. And that case,

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to this day, again, has never been solved. And that was in the 90s. And so is this going to fall into that

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bucket where everybody's going to get close? And because of the other, you know, high level projects

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that this guy was overseeing, they can't get close enough. Bottom line is we don't know what happened

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to him. We just don't know. That's the honest answer. I will say if you were in the Sandia

[0:26:18 - 0:26:22] ▶

foothills on February 27th, 28th, check your cameras, the doorbell footage, dash cams, photos you took that day.

[0:26:22 - 0:26:28] ▶

You can submit tips to the Bernalillo County Sheriff's Office Missing Persons Unit at 505-468-7070.

[0:26:28 - 0:26:34] ▶

You can text anonymously through TIP-401, text BCSO and your TIP to 847-411. Chris, thank you so much

[0:26:34 - 0:26:43] ▶

for taking the time. Really appreciate it. Thank you, Jesse. That's all we have for you right now here

[0:26:43 - 0:26:47] ▶

on Sidebar. Everybody, thank you so much for joining us. And as always, please subscribe on YouTube,

[0:26:47 - 0:26:51] ▶

Apple Podcasts, Spotify, wherever you should get your podcasts. You can also check us out on NBC's

[0:26:51 - 0:26:56] ▶

Peacock as well. If you want to follow me, X Instagram, my News Nation show, Jesse Weber Live,

[0:26:56 - 0:27:01] ▶

Monday through Friday, 11 p.m. Eastern. I'll see you next time, everybody.

[0:27:01 - 0:27:04] ▶