1,146 segments
Hello and welcome to Reality Check.
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Now, let's get on and enjoy the show.
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G'day and welcome back to Reality Check.
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Well, today we've got a very special show.
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You will recall earlier this year I brought Jake Barber to the world.
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Jake Barber, the former intelligence insider who told the story of his role in the legacy
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retrieval program for UAPs.
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Jack told us at the time he was going to found an organization in collaboration with other
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people called Skywatcher.
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And Skywatcher indeed has been in operation now for quite a few months and I'm pleased
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to be able to reveal on today's program and welcome Matthew Pines, the commentator,
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geopolitical, national security commentator who we've welcomed to the show before.
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He's coming today in a new role as if you like, let me get this right, Matthew, the official
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spokesperson for Skywatcher.
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So, did you advise her here to help them with their overall messaging and communication
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So, really great to be on board and join the illustrious Compadres at Skywatcher.
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And Jake, welcome back, you're an old friend of the show.
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It's great to have you back on board.
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Thank you so much to both of you for appearing.
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We're delighted to have you on board because I can tell you of all the things that people
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And one of the things I've admired about you, Jake, is you've been putting yourself
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out there on social media.
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You've been responding to questions.
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And here today is a good opportunity to get into the detail.
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First up, first up, Matthew, as I understand it, you're about to release later this week,
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a document which you call the Skywatcher Discovery Framework.
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It's a protocol for how you intend to investigate and corroborate or disprove the phenomenon.
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Take us through it, please.
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What is this Discovery Framework?
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Yes, thanks for asking about that.
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And we hope to have that out shortly after this air.
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So beyond look out, folks can dig into the details.
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I won't go into too much of that right now.
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But at the top level, it's a document really meant to anchor how we think about our overall
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approach to collecting data and then sharing our findings with the public.
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Skywatcher is not meant to do its work in the shadows.
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We want to do things in the open.
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We want to have a transparent and rigorous scientific approach that brings in all experts
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and folks that are observing these activities.
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But we want to apply the rigorous scientific method to our work and to how we communicate
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the level of confidence in our findings.
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Right now, we're in a zone of ambiguity and uncertainty around lots of UAP related information
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and data, things that are mostly anecdotes.
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We want to provide a framework that can go from anecdotes, intriguing images, intriguing
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encounters or experiences to definitive scientific validated conclusions that can be shared
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and that can be the basis for public conversations and public policy.
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So this document meant to anchor where we think our current understanding is and the methodologies
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that we're putting to the test.
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But also recognize where we still have a lot of work to go.
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We're still at the early innings of this approach and we want to show where we think we
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want to end up by the end of the year.
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So Jake, for the benefit of the audience that don't know what Skywatcher is, can you explain
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to us what Skywatcher is?
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What's your ambition?
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What's your goal and how are you doing it?
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Yeah, pretty much is Matt just outlined, but we want to move from a low level to a very
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high level with our exploration of what this phenomenon is.
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And that starts with the anecdotal side or the very personal or subjective side and move
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all the way from there, all the way to a point of scientific discovery.
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I like to point out that that anecdotal side is valuable.
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It catches a lot of heat and it seems like we have a lot of that in the public domain
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and most of the arguments are about anecdotal experiences.
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But that's still a very important place because without that we don't have, we can't come
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up with theories and that's also where our motivation comes from because we need a good
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reason to deploy the scientific method to begin with.
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And so that starts with all of these things that people are experiencing at large.
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And so what Skywatcher is meant to do is to take all the people that can facilitate
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that process of moving from an interesting, something worthwhile and interesting to
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a point that it becomes a scientific discovery and is now impacting reality and is integrated
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into our culture and everything else.
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So the heart of this is proof of perhaps the biggest story in human history that potentially
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we may not be alone.
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Yeah, that's certainly one of the possibilities of where this is going and that's really
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exciting for all of us.
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I mean, we're all human.
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We're all in awe of that idea.
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But we have to be very careful about accepting whatever the outcome is and it's not going
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to be anything boring.
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But exactly what it is where it comes from that those possibilities keep broadening.
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Haven't you already been doing quite a few months of work with Skywatcher?
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Where are you at at the moment?
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Yeah, well, we are actually literally out on the range today.
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We're on our third day out on the range recording episode three.
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As I'm sure we'll talk about a little bit here.
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We still episode two is going to be released on April 7th.
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But we have a budget to operate in the field for about seven days a month.
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The three weeks in between, if you will, is spent planning and assessing and editing the
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experience from the three weeks prior.
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We've been very successful and we look forward to going over and actually sharing some of
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the successes we've had last month and then even they're happening today and tomorrow.
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So Matthew, I want to take you through the levels of proof that you're going to work through.
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But before we get there, Jake, you say you've been successful.
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Where are you at at the moment?
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Like in terms of I know Matthew, you haven't been out on the range yet, but you're about
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I'm looking forward to hearing from you about that.
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But what are you what have you actually seen today?
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Yeah, I'll tell you.
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So episode two that releases April 7th is going to be the first time we introduce one
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of our key members who runs our technology side of the house, what we call our technology
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And in that episode, he is going to be our lead in taking everyone through what we call
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our nine classes of UAP.
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And the nine classes of UAP are what we use to try and separate and classify and differentiate
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between all the different things we're witnessing.
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And those nine classes are really sub-components of a broader maybe three categories.
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And those three categories are something like actual craft, like machinery flying in
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the sky to light phenomenon that can be crystals, beams, orbs, flat things that appear to be
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something like a plasma blob in the sky all the way to flying creatures, like what might
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be a flying jellyfish or an interdimensional creature is crazy as that sounds.
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But there is a class or a set of classes that falls under that category as well.
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And Jake, just to forgive me for interrupting.
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Just to be clear on this, when you say these nine classes, are these nine classes that
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you have already recorded, seen?
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So they are proprietary.
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It's our class system that we've come up with.
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And that's what we're going to be sharing.
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I think one of the classes that people are going to be most excited to see, because it's
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And arguably one of the most famous and interesting UFO, UAP classes out there is the Tic Tac.
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So on April 7th, you'll get to see our interactions with the Tic Tac.
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We had a lot of success with the Tic Tac in episode two or the filming of that.
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It showed up for several days in broad daylight, dropping from above 80,000 feet as everyone
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We pick it up on our radar.
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We image it through a number of different means.
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And so that's going to be exciting to see, because that's one of the ones that holds the
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most promise for an exciting conclusion right now.
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Now, you just, I can't let this one go by.
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You talked about the jellyfish.
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Have you seen a jellyfish and have you videoed a jellyfish?
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And why we call it a jellyfish?
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Like we take a pretty humble like kindergarten approach to our classifications to make it simple
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Like it literally just looks like a jellyfish.
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It looks like like a head of a mushroom with tentacles in there.
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And there seems to be like electrical pulses that go up and down between the head and the
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And I don't want to get too much into it because I want to allow my teammates that we're
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going to be introducing an episode to a chance to go into this.
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And they have, they have a very specific story to tell there.
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And I don't want to spoil it for them.
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But I know I can understand you want to save the best for later.
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Can I ask you this though?
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Of the nine, you talk about the three subclasses, if you like.
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Can you categorize for us in a descriptive term, the nine classes that you're talking
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You know what I'll say that I will just say again that the classes come from three broader
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We've got basically what look like craft or machinery.
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You've got what are so, so anomalous, let's say, that they are just, they put off what
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we can detect as some interesting light signature from like a vibrating crystal to a pulsating
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And then the last is we don't know what they are.
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But it moves and behaves like what you would think a wild animal or a secreture would behave.
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But it's in the sky, it's in the atmosphere.
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So let's go to Mattner.
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So Matt, you have the task, I guess, of strategically advising this group on how to, I guess,
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collate and present this data in a way that is scientifically rigorous.
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And there are a number of levels.
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So I think you've got six levels that you've set out in this framework that you've put
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What are those six levels?
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Yeah, so it's a good maybe walk through with an example, right?
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So you take the jellyfish or the tic-tac, right?
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Which is Ben Seen in other videos, some officially released, some leaked with debate about
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But at that level you have an image.
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You have a clip of a video.
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You have maybe secondhand reports of the nature of that encounter or that observation.
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And that is sort of, you know, in our scheme, kind of like level one, right?
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And since it's not our data, right, we're taking someone else's apparent data.
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And you can assess it, you can look at that.
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But it's hard to come up with like definitive scientific conclusions, which is that amount
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It's a good place to start, as Jake mentioned.
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It clearly is something that needs to be explained.
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And it doesn't allow you to make really much, much of anything in terms of a conclusion.
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So where we want to take the next step is, you know, in level two, essentially structure
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data collection, right?
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Which requires actually putting a lot of resources out into the field for a long period of time
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with specialized skills and equipment and analytic methodologies to collect data on those
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And so that's really what SkyWarture is principally engaged in right now is structure data collection,
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right, to bring out into a controlled environment as much as you can control it, multiple different
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data collection modalities, different sensors, right?
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Radars, different multi-band infrared, electro-optical, multiple observers in different location,
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trained observers in different platforms and helicopters on the ground.
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And, you know, collecting information over a long period of time in order to build a
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vicinity evidence base, right?
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You get anomalous things, you see interesting things.
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Okay, and then you go to level three, which is hypothesis testing.
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Okay, we have these different classes.
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We observed them under these different conditions.
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They came in response to these different interrogation modalities.
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This was the patterns we saw over time.
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This is the historical trend that we witnessed.
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This is the characteristics that are consistent in those different observations.
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That's how you build up an evidence base that then generates hypotheses around.
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Okay, are these different classes fundamentally different?
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So they just different manifestations of the same underlying phenomenon.
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And then we want to get to the point where we can then generate novel and rigorously formulated
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hypotheses against that data.
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And then you can produce that analysis.
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Then you can share your analysis.
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We think this observation that is on multiple sensors that was confirmed by multiple, you
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know, different observers that was seen in many different categories over time.
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This is a real observation of a highly anomalous object displaying performance characteristics
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or a pair of morphologies that are truly anomalous and exotic.
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That have known apparent obvious explanation in terms of conventional aircraft or misidentification
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or bugs or whatever, right?
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So that's what we want to get to in level three is you have the data to be able to formulate
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hypotheses that then you can do your analysis and then share your analysis that demonstrates.
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You think this is highly anomalous and then level four, get that to be peer reviewed, right?
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You want to get that independently tested, get others to sort of poke at your data, poke
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your conclusions, try to assess, well, was this actually a misidentification that you can
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Is there something in the environment that otherwise could explain that?
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And ideally, you try to really poke as many holes as possible in that preliminary findings
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and we'll publish our results and we'll want to get folks to take a second crack at it.
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But ultimately, right, the scientific method is you have peer review and if it stands up
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to scrutiny, then it becomes not final conclusion, but it becomes something that is in worthy
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of increasingly serious attention by policymakers, right?
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That had to take a look at this data and other folks have to have a responsibility to understand
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anomalous phenomenon, have to then take a hard look at the data that's coming out of efforts
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like Skywalker and decide, okay, is this something that we need to prepare for that the
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public needs to understand is a potential reality as a phenomenon that isn't, you know,
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fictitious isn't just resolve the misidentifications but is a real observable in nature.
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And then that can trigger other conversations on the public policy front where it's about
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digesting the reality of this different phenomenon.
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But I think we're still at that level two to level three to level four stage in the next
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and the next and the basic objectives of sort of get to that point by the end of the year.
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Can I get some to that Ross?
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So yeah, what we have what we call a transition criteria.
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So before we move from level one to level two or all the way up to level six, we have
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established a criteria for ourselves and this what that means is that this could take
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This we're not here to produce an entertainment piece.
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We aren't we aren't we aren't driven or motivated by putting out a certain pacing of episodes.
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We are here to do the hard work and focus on scientific discovery.
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And we're ultimately going to be limited by our own transition criteria on each one of
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And with six different levels, I can't tell you what I can't tell you is it's been very
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exciting so far and level one and level two have been a lot of fun.
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Yeah, and I'll say the last point is a picture or a video is almost never proof of anything.
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The whole point is you need multiple different sensor sources all corroborating the same
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object from different perspectives showing anomalous behavior, showing anomalous morphologies
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and being able to then validate that the sensors were not malfunctioning and that you see
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that repeatedly over time.
[0:18:32 - 0:18:34] ▶
And so it's not just a matter of okay, show me some video of something and that's going
[0:18:35 - 0:18:38] ▶
to be the slam dunk proof.
[0:18:38 - 0:18:39] ▶
But you have to show your analysis, you have to show your work, which is this is the video,
[0:18:39 - 0:18:43] ▶
this is the radar, this was the infrared, this was the human observations and then this
[0:18:43 - 0:18:47] ▶
was the consistent pattern that all points in the same direction over time.
[0:18:47 - 0:18:52] ▶
And then you can say, well, this is something anomalous and we have high confidence that
[0:18:52 - 0:18:56] ▶
this object is real and is highly anomalous.
[0:18:56 - 0:18:59] ▶
And so you don't ever speak in terms of proof, you speak in terms of levels of confidence
[0:18:59 - 0:19:02] ▶
and the amount of independent valid data that you're basing that confidence on.
[0:19:02 - 0:19:07] ▶
I like the fact that you're not jumping to conclusions and I think one of the things
[0:19:08 - 0:19:11] ▶
that's been thrown at Skywatcher is, you know, you're keeping it all very much in the
[0:19:11 - 0:19:16] ▶
It sounds to me like you're prepared to be transparent.
[0:19:17 - 0:19:19] ▶
Just for the sake of our audience, let's go through the levels that you've just described
[0:19:19 - 0:19:23] ▶
So level one is preliminary observation.
[0:19:24 - 0:19:26] ▶
Level two is structured data collection.
[0:19:26 - 0:19:29] ▶
Level three is analysis and hypothesis testing.
[0:19:29 - 0:19:33] ▶
Level four is independent verification and peer review.
[0:19:33 - 0:19:37] ▶
Level five is public disclosure and review.
[0:19:37 - 0:19:40] ▶
And level six is full disclosure and integration.
[0:19:40 - 0:19:45] ▶
Now just so I can encapsulate this, one of the other things that's in your document is
[0:19:45 - 0:19:51] ▶
you've got a new term for what I would call the psionic inviting or summoning and I
[0:19:51 - 0:19:57] ▶
can understand why you've changed the term because it's a fairly loaded term and you've
[0:19:57 - 0:20:01] ▶
got this new term which is neuro meditative, what are you calling it?
[0:20:01 - 0:20:10] ▶
What do you call it, Jake?
[0:20:10 - 0:20:11] ▶
Neural meditative interaction or we call our psionic assets, neural meditators.
[0:20:11 - 0:20:18] ▶
So, so neuro meditative interaction.
[0:20:18 - 0:20:21] ▶
That's what we previously have called psionic.
[0:20:21 - 0:20:24] ▶
So the other one is electro mechanical signaling which I've previously known as the dog whistle
[0:20:24 - 0:20:30] ▶
when I interviewed you earlier this year, you referred to her in your previous role in
[0:20:30 - 0:20:36] ▶
There was a device used known as the dog whistle.
[0:20:37 - 0:20:41] ▶
And so there's two different techniques here.
[0:20:41 - 0:20:44] ▶
One is electro mechanical signaling and the other is this neuro meditative interaction.
[0:20:44 - 0:20:52] ▶
Yeah, to go back to keeping it kindergarten, like we have machine based calling and measurement
[0:20:52 - 0:20:57] ▶
and we have man based or human based calling and measurement.
[0:20:57 - 0:21:01] ▶
And they're both used on both ends of that.
[0:21:01 - 0:21:04] ▶
So the neuro meditative process is also one that we use for data collection if you will,
[0:21:04 - 0:21:11] ▶
not just the calling or luring process.
[0:21:11 - 0:21:14] ▶
Now this is doing my head in because of course we're talking at a time and I think history
[0:21:14 - 0:21:18] ▶
will one day record this and show this.
[0:21:18 - 0:21:21] ▶
We're talking at a time where officially Jake and Matt the Pentagon categorically denies
[0:21:21 - 0:21:27] ▶
any knowledge of human interaction with a non-human intelligence or at least with an
[0:21:27 - 0:21:33] ▶
extra terrestrial intelligence.
[0:21:33 - 0:21:36] ▶
You are saying that obviously the research that you're doing at the moment, Skywatcher
[0:21:36 - 0:21:42] ▶
is now at the point where it is detecting something.
[0:21:42 - 0:21:48] ▶
Is it discernibly anomalous?
[0:21:48 - 0:21:50] ▶
How are you at the stage where you can say that what you're looking at is anomalous?
[0:21:50 - 0:21:56] ▶
Well, in defense of the defense department, this is bigger than a defense subject.
[0:21:56 - 0:22:02] ▶
So maybe they're not the best ones to be the subject matter experts on this holistically
[0:22:02 - 0:22:09] ▶
They have a very narrow focus and we want them focused on national defense.
[0:22:10 - 0:22:15] ▶
The more we get into this and the more broadly we look at it and the more scrupulously we
[0:22:15 - 0:22:19] ▶
The more we realize it as implications way beyond technology that could be used for defense
[0:22:20 - 0:22:25] ▶
And so like this is why we're taking this approach.
[0:22:26 - 0:22:31] ▶
We're trying to involve people from all aspects of life and a variety of scientists.
[0:22:31 - 0:22:37] ▶
So scientists themselves are very diverse.
[0:22:37 - 0:22:41] ▶
What you really have is a group of individuals who have a varying degree of expertise in
[0:22:41 - 0:22:50] ▶
the ability to deploy the scientific method.
[0:22:50 - 0:22:52] ▶
And where that becomes really helpful for us, our primary focus right now from the creative
[0:22:52 - 0:22:57] ▶
and innovation standpoint comes in the form of experiments.
[0:22:57 - 0:23:01] ▶
We need a lot of experiments and we need all heads and hands on deck in order to come up
[0:23:01 - 0:23:08] ▶
with the right set of experiments that will allow us to meet that transition criteria
[0:23:08 - 0:23:13] ▶
to move through the levels.
[0:23:13 - 0:23:15] ▶
And Ross, to your question, I would say in the discovery framework paper, we give a sort
[0:23:16 - 0:23:23] ▶
of preliminary assessment of where we think these two techniques sit.
[0:23:23 - 0:23:27] ▶
So interiors are like how far how far we've got in terms of levels of confidence in demonstrating
[0:23:27 - 0:23:33] ▶
the reality of these phenomenon.
[0:23:33 - 0:23:35] ▶
The neurom sorry the election mechanical signaling, the sort of machine calling dog whistle,
[0:23:35 - 0:23:41] ▶
we have assessed at level three right in the sense that we are we have a good evidence
[0:23:41 - 0:23:48] ▶
base of it being reliably effective at resulting in UAP phenomenon of those nine characteristic
[0:23:48 - 0:23:55] ▶
classes appearing directly overhead repeatedly over many, many different sort of trial runs.
[0:23:55 - 0:24:03] ▶
And so that we have high confidence is apparently effective right.
[0:24:03 - 0:24:06] ▶
We don't have a we have one have a good scientific hypothesis as to the underlying mechanism
[0:24:06 - 0:24:11] ▶
of its effect or what sort of conditionality is you place on that on that effect.
[0:24:11 - 0:24:16] ▶
Whereas they're the neuro meditative interaction we have at level two right.
[0:24:16 - 0:24:20] ▶
We have strong I would say in the technical jargon sort of a sort of a phenomenological evidence
[0:24:20 - 0:24:24] ▶
right the first person experience of the personnel on the team performing these activities
[0:24:24 - 0:24:31] ▶
that it is effective.
[0:24:31 - 0:24:32] ▶
And it seems in certain cases to result in in in UAP phenomenon that correlate with what
[0:24:32 - 0:24:37] ▶
those individuals either predicted or were describing.
[0:24:37 - 0:24:40] ▶
It's but we want to collect more data right.
[0:24:40 - 0:24:42] ▶
This is why you want to have as controlled field experiments as possible and then to cross
[0:24:42 - 0:24:46] ▶
correlate those two different techniques both the machine calling as well as the human factors
[0:24:46 - 0:24:50] ▶
component to see is this is there is there a piece where one amplifies the other where
[0:24:50 - 0:24:55] ▶
one can be used as a test of the other ones effectiveness.
[0:24:55 - 0:24:58] ▶
So that's where we are now is in collecting the data but I think we have enough to
[0:24:58 - 0:25:02] ▶
go from this is imperial anecdotal right we're starting to collect real field data real
[0:25:02 - 0:25:07] ▶
But it's it's you know it's hard at this point to say you're going to publish a paper
[0:25:08 - 0:25:11] ▶
on that right you can have initial promising results in the lab but that still means you're
[0:25:11 - 0:25:15] ▶
a long way from publishing that paper in the journal.
[0:25:15 - 0:25:18] ▶
Yeah this is music to my ears because this is going to show our audience what is necessary
[0:25:18 - 0:25:24] ▶
in order to prove that something is genuinely anomalous and explainable as potential non-human
[0:25:24 - 0:25:31] ▶
I get on a weekly basis now hundreds possibly thousands of videos sent to me by people
[0:25:32 - 0:25:38] ▶
from all over the world and I don't know what to do with them because frankly how do you
[0:25:38 - 0:25:43] ▶
verify something like that you know what you need.
[0:25:43 - 0:25:47] ▶
Ross I think this is an important distinction to make like a lower to make the distance
[0:25:47 - 0:25:53] ▶
between the rungs on this ladder we're trying to send closer together.
[0:25:53 - 0:25:56] ▶
The first step is not knowing what it is.
[0:25:56 - 0:25:59] ▶
It is it's a very powerful thing for us to be able to say something is truly anomalous
[0:25:59 - 0:26:04] ▶
because what that means is that we've gathered a very strong and qualified group of people
[0:26:04 - 0:26:10] ▶
in processes and thrown at all at something we're observing and not been able to define
[0:26:10 - 0:26:16] ▶
So the negative there is very powerful because we should be able to produce positives
[0:26:17 - 0:26:21] ▶
and define pretty much anything at our sky at this point with this group of people and
[0:26:21 - 0:26:26] ▶
processes and equipment.
[0:26:26 - 0:26:28] ▶
And so truly proving too quickly these acronyms like UFO quickly be meant like any time it
[0:26:28 - 0:26:36] ▶
was used in the vernacular alien origin.
[0:26:36 - 0:26:39] ▶
We switched that up and now we got UAP and that's already evolved pretty much I think in
[0:26:39 - 0:26:44] ▶
people's minds as being alien and origin and it's not.
[0:26:44 - 0:26:48] ▶
To prove that something is truly an unidentified anomalous phenomenon is a great step because
[0:26:48 - 0:26:54] ▶
it's not a blanket statement you throw out at everything.
[0:26:54 - 0:26:57] ▶
We actually are going through the there's a process to be able to say wow we threw all
[0:26:57 - 0:27:02] ▶
this at that this phenomenon and we can't define what it is that's pretty exciting and
[0:27:02 - 0:27:08] ▶
No it's fantastic I mean I'm I'm actually really excited for what you guys are doing.
[0:27:09 - 0:27:15] ▶
So you're actually at level three of preparedness and now moving to level four which is independent
[0:27:15 - 0:27:21] ▶
verification on the electro mechanical signaling which I'm afraid I will always call the dog
[0:27:21 - 0:27:27] ▶
In your document you say quote level three means there are now one or more pieces of recorded
[0:27:28 - 0:27:34] ▶
data, videos, sensor readings that show something truly anomalous meaning preliminary checks
[0:27:34 - 0:27:42] ▶
haven't identified it yet as a known object.
[0:27:42 - 0:27:46] ▶
So can you explain to me any of the detail of what it is that you've picked up or detected
[0:27:46 - 0:27:50] ▶
as a result of using your electro mechanical signaling the dog whistle.
[0:27:50 - 0:27:57] ▶
Maybe I'll take this moment to differentiate something here that I thought of while you
[0:27:57 - 0:28:00] ▶
guys while Matt was speaking.
[0:28:00 - 0:28:02] ▶
When we talk about the jellyfish this is not the jellyfish that you have seen on TV
[0:28:02 - 0:28:06] ▶
or online over the last year which kind of looks like a flying house plant.
[0:28:06 - 0:28:11] ▶
This does for like the aquatic creature it's like purple maroon metallic with a mushroom
[0:28:11 - 0:28:17] ▶
head that contracts and extends and retract its tentacles it looks like the aquatic creature.
[0:28:17 - 0:28:23] ▶
So again without spoiling episode two and allowing my colleague to go through these classes
[0:28:23 - 0:28:31] ▶
appropriately and thoroughly.
[0:28:31 - 0:28:33] ▶
I'll just say that when we get something on radar I mean we are looking for we're looking
[0:28:33 - 0:28:40] ▶
to be able to describe it and write it off as something explainable to begin with.
[0:28:40 - 0:28:44] ▶
So like so you're looking at like what Lou talks about the five observables certainly
[0:28:44 - 0:28:51] ▶
that's in play anything that might look like a balloon.
[0:28:51 - 0:28:55] ▶
Balloons tend to be the scapegoat when you don't have any other bucket to put it in we
[0:28:55 - 0:29:01] ▶
all like to use the balloon bucket and admittedly a lot of this stuff looks like a balloon
[0:29:01 - 0:29:07] ▶
like you could take a mylar balloon and we've actually played with that in the field.
[0:29:07 - 0:29:11] ▶
We launch our own balloons to see if we can can deep fake our own data by launching balloons
[0:29:11 - 0:29:18] ▶
and seeing if we could could manufacture something that looks like the anomalous stuff we're
[0:29:18 - 0:29:24] ▶
And balloons get ruled out pretty quickly when you take into account win because balloons
[0:29:25 - 0:29:32] ▶
are going to move pretty close to the vector or the direction of travel of the wind and
[0:29:32 - 0:29:39] ▶
pretty much at the velocity of the wind.
[0:29:39 - 0:29:41] ▶
So as soon as you start moving perpendicular to the wind or any angle not directly downwind
[0:29:41 - 0:29:46] ▶
at velocity is different than the ambient wind velocity.
[0:29:46 - 0:29:50] ▶
And then you just get ruled out pretty quickly despite how much you want to believe that
[0:29:50 - 0:29:55] ▶
it's a balloon because there are things there are classes that look like it could be a
[0:29:55 - 0:30:01] ▶
balloon until it starts morphing and changing like balloons aren't going to change the way
[0:30:01 - 0:30:07] ▶
they look and their radar signature also is something that's pretty distinctive.
[0:30:07 - 0:30:12] ▶
Now I'm not one of our radar operators.
[0:30:12 - 0:30:14] ▶
I'm not an analyst for radar but I'm in our tactical operation center when we're looking
[0:30:14 - 0:30:22] ▶
at this stuff and I can tell you that the last thing any of us want is to look foolish
[0:30:22 - 0:30:29] ▶
by putting something out to the public and saying we think it's anomalous and then having
[0:30:29 - 0:30:36] ▶
it easily explained away by all the armchair quarter bats watching the internet around
[0:30:36 - 0:30:41] ▶
So I just saw clear on this Jake in the episode two video we are going to see the jellyfish.
[0:30:43 - 0:30:51] ▶
Yep, you're going to see it on video, you're going to see images of it, you're going to
[0:30:52 - 0:30:57] ▶
see a couple of them.
[0:30:57 - 0:31:00] ▶
And these have come as a result you believe there's a correlation between the electro-mechanical
[0:31:00 - 0:31:08] ▶
signaling, the dog whistle, causing these objects to arrive.
[0:31:08 - 0:31:13] ▶
Are you in a position yet to be able to say that the electro-mechanical signaling is probably
[0:31:13 - 0:31:18] ▶
responsible for attracting those objects?
[0:31:18 - 0:31:21] ▶
Well, you know everyone's heard the phrase correlation is not causation but again like
[0:31:21 - 0:31:29] ▶
anecdotal evidence is not worthless.
[0:31:29 - 0:31:32] ▶
There is a process to where correlation can begin to evolve into data and into evidence
[0:31:33 - 0:31:39] ▶
and into so on, it goes up the chain.
[0:31:39 - 0:31:42] ▶
So correlation is an important thing and you start running into probabilities when correlation
[0:31:42 - 0:31:49] ▶
is so high and so repeatable you run out of lack of other explanations.
[0:31:49 - 0:31:55] ▶
Our scientists could do a better job explaining how correlation is actually integrated into
[0:31:55 - 0:31:59] ▶
meaningful information.
[0:31:59 - 0:32:01] ▶
But yes, there is a very strong correlation that's repeatable and predictable when we use
[0:32:01 - 0:32:07] ▶
our dog whistle system and these things show up.
[0:32:07 - 0:32:13] ▶
Yeah, so the one way to construct what you would try to get as close to a scientific test
[0:32:13 - 0:32:18] ▶
and we have done this, although the more trials you do the more you're going to get confidence
[0:32:18 - 0:32:22] ▶
is have a control, right?
[0:32:22 - 0:32:24] ▶
So the dog whistle is a certain very specific characteristic type of signal that you put
[0:32:24 - 0:32:28] ▶
out there and then you wait to see if you're going to see a characteristic set of observed
[0:32:28 - 0:32:32] ▶
UAP phenomenon appear or not.
[0:32:32 - 0:32:35] ▶
And then you do everything else ideally as constant as possible.
[0:32:35 - 0:32:39] ▶
You do a sort of random noise signal, nothing that you know is associated with attracting
[0:32:39 - 0:32:43] ▶
UAP and you see, right, with every other condition the same do UAP appear or not.
[0:32:43 - 0:32:49] ▶
And the apparent observations we've had again with a certain amount of data collected is
[0:32:49 - 0:32:53] ▶
that when you flip the dog whistle on the UAP appear.
[0:32:53 - 0:32:56] ▶
If you just flip on a noise control signal, they do not.
[0:32:56 - 0:33:00] ▶
Now, how often is that the case?
[0:33:00 - 0:33:02] ▶
So is it 100% of the time that when you sound the dog whistle, the the electro mechanical
[0:33:02 - 0:33:07] ▶
signaling does do the objects come all the time?
[0:33:07 - 0:33:11] ▶
Okay, I'm going to be very bold right here and I'm going to tell you that 100% of the
[0:33:11 - 0:33:17] ▶
time when we run our operation with the dog whistle, we get results in broad daylight that
[0:33:17 - 0:33:24] ▶
is visible from multiple observation posts.
[0:33:24 - 0:33:29] ▶
And another thing to run a control with correlation is the things that we are seeing are so anomalous.
[0:33:29 - 0:33:34] ▶
Not only are they not showing up when you run some some form of technological placebo,
[0:33:34 - 0:33:41] ▶
let's say, show me anywhere else that anyone has ever seen in any of these things.
[0:33:41 - 0:33:47] ▶
Like they don't you would if they're if they were not responding to the dog whistle, we
[0:33:47 - 0:33:52] ▶
would see videos of this jellyfish that you're going to see through cell phone
[0:33:52 - 0:33:56] ▶
footages out of airliners and other people observing your mind.
[0:33:56 - 0:33:59] ▶
I've never seen this outside of well, let's just say this doesn't exist in the public domain.
[0:33:59 - 0:34:08] ▶
The only one that does is the tic tac and we all know how exciting and how respectable
[0:34:08 - 0:34:16] ▶
the tic tac accounts are.
[0:34:16 - 0:34:17] ▶
Those are not to be dismissed as random events.
[0:34:17 - 0:34:22] ▶
And how close have your sensors or eyeballs got to these objects?
[0:34:22 - 0:34:27] ▶
How close have they got to sky watches?
[0:34:27 - 0:34:29] ▶
They've got where we can see them with the naked eye.
[0:34:29 - 0:34:32] ▶
Is that hundreds of meters kilometers?
[0:34:32 - 0:34:35] ▶
What are we talking about?
[0:34:35 - 0:34:37] ▶
Less than a half a mile, less 4,000 feet, AGL and below.
[0:34:37 - 0:34:42] ▶
So these are obviously very dramatic images, I suspect.
[0:34:45 - 0:34:49] ▶
Now, you know, these things are very hard to image and even with our expensive equipment.
[0:34:49 - 0:34:56] ▶
That's not the most spectacular image.
[0:34:56 - 0:34:58] ▶
It's not going to be like what you would see in Hollywood.
[0:34:58 - 0:35:01] ▶
I A.I. is going to do a much better job of putting together something like this.
[0:35:01 - 0:35:06] ▶
They in our episode, we show you the raw data not zoomed in and then we'll show you some
[0:35:06 - 0:35:12] ▶
But it's certainly again, some of some of what is considered data.
[0:35:14 - 0:35:20] ▶
There's a bit of a dichotomy because things that are the most respectable from a data standpoint
[0:35:21 - 0:35:25] ▶
aren't always the most spectacular from like an entertainment standpoint.
[0:35:25 - 0:35:31] ▶
Some of the things that are probably spectacular that people would like to see, you know, really
[0:35:31 - 0:35:37] ▶
don't exist in this realm.
[0:35:37 - 0:35:38] ▶
Real data at times can be less sensational than arbitrary data, I guess.
[0:35:38 - 0:35:44] ▶
So Matt, you've come into this from the outside.
[0:35:45 - 0:35:48] ▶
I mean, previously like me, you've known nothing about what's got watches up to.
[0:35:48 - 0:35:52] ▶
Has it been a revelation for you to see the degree of achievement gain that they've
[0:35:52 - 0:36:00] ▶
actually got in their files at the moment?
[0:36:00 - 0:36:04] ▶
You know, it was definitely a learning curve, right?
[0:36:04 - 0:36:07] ▶
To go from, I'd say, the analytical professional observer of this phenomenon and the different
[0:36:07 - 0:36:16] ▶
kind of political implications, the national security implications that I've been, you know,
[0:36:16 - 0:36:19] ▶
But to see it kind of be like a practical activity that a relatively small organization
[0:36:21 - 0:36:27] ▶
can decide you just go do, that has been the most surprising thing to me.
[0:36:27 - 0:36:31] ▶
Like I've already become convinced of the reality of the phenomenon, but the fact that you
[0:36:31 - 0:36:35] ▶
can have a relatively small group of people with the motivation and the capability to just
[0:36:35 - 0:36:40] ▶
To just get the team together, to get the resources and the capabilities, the equipment and
[0:36:41 - 0:36:47] ▶
the effort and the public spiritiness to do this in the open.
[0:36:47 - 0:36:50] ▶
That's the thing that's most surprising to me, right?
[0:36:50 - 0:36:52] ▶
Because I think a lot of these activities have been happening, right?
[0:36:52 - 0:36:55] ▶
These techniques are not new to Skywatcher.
[0:36:55 - 0:36:58] ▶
These techniques are known, I think, to other people involved in the legacy programs.
[0:36:58 - 0:37:04] ▶
We are just doing this in a very different way in a way that hopefully going to bring
[0:37:04 - 0:37:09] ▶
this into the public conversation in a rigorous and transparent manner.
[0:37:09 - 0:37:13] ▶
That has been the part that I was not prepared for.
[0:37:13 - 0:37:15] ▶
I was not expecting, right, as a possibility, right?
[0:37:15 - 0:37:19] ▶
That could help build kind of a bridge to disclosure from the private sector, right?
[0:37:19 - 0:37:24] ▶
Everyone's looking for the government to declassify things, to convene special task forces,
[0:37:24 - 0:37:29] ▶
to hold people to account.
[0:37:29 - 0:37:31] ▶
I think there's a lot of that activity that needs to happen, right?
[0:37:31 - 0:37:35] ▶
But ultimately, there's a different game you can play, right?
[0:37:35 - 0:37:38] ▶
Which is, the skies aren't classified.
[0:37:38 - 0:37:40] ▶
This phenomenon and these techniques aren't classified.
[0:37:40 - 0:37:43] ▶
You just need to get the right people in the right places doing the right things for the
[0:37:43 - 0:37:47] ▶
I think you can have a very significant impact.
[0:37:48 - 0:37:51] ▶
I maybe even help the government kind of get out of the corner that it's stuck in.
[0:37:51 - 0:37:55] ▶
So why is there this semantic change?
[0:37:55 - 0:37:58] ▶
Why have you moved away from the word psionic?
[0:37:58 - 0:38:01] ▶
And why are you moving away from the word dog whistle?
[0:38:01 - 0:38:03] ▶
I mean, I don't know.
[0:38:03 - 0:38:05] ▶
I don't know that we're moving away from it.
[0:38:06 - 0:38:08] ▶
I like the word psionic.
[0:38:08 - 0:38:11] ▶
I hope it's not short lived.
[0:38:11 - 0:38:12] ▶
And I think we'll just as creatures, as humans, we'll gravitate back to these kindergarten
[0:38:12 - 0:38:17] ▶
But we also, because the phrasing is going to help us identify what it is.
[0:38:20 - 0:38:25] ▶
But we look at neural meditation.
[0:38:25 - 0:38:27] ▶
Well that has a very specific meaning.
[0:38:27 - 0:38:30] ▶
And it categorizes better where we are directing our experiments and our efforts.
[0:38:30 - 0:38:35] ▶
Psionics is like, it's a sexy rock and roll term for what it is, which is great to have
[0:38:35 - 0:38:42] ▶
in the public vernacular.
[0:38:42 - 0:38:43] ▶
But when we are trying to really pin down what it is, we need to assign, I think, more appropriate
[0:38:43 - 0:38:49] ▶
names that describe the direction of our research.
[0:38:49 - 0:38:53] ▶
Yeah, and I think everyone has a slightly different take on this on the team, which is
[0:38:54 - 0:38:57] ▶
Some are very like, are the scientists and scientists are very precise with their, with
[0:38:58 - 0:39:03] ▶
their verbiage, right?
[0:39:03 - 0:39:04] ▶
And they're thinking about communicating to like a peer audience, right?
[0:39:04 - 0:39:08] ▶
Which is when you're describing and say a novel phenomenon, you want to use the most
[0:39:08 - 0:39:11] ▶
kind of bland descriptive term possible so that it connects with the scientific discipline
[0:39:11 - 0:39:17] ▶
that you want to communicate with with, with the lay audience, right?
[0:39:17 - 0:39:20] ▶
Neuro meditative does not roll off the tongue.
[0:39:20 - 0:39:22] ▶
It's maybe not the most sort of salient jargon to use in sort of a larger conversation.
[0:39:22 - 0:39:28] ▶
The other key point I think we have on the Neuro meditative side, which is almost as important
[0:39:28 - 0:39:33] ▶
and sort of lurks underneath the radar as the, as the UAP side, which is, you know, that
[0:39:33 - 0:39:39] ▶
is a phenomenon that we also seek to rigorously assess, right?
[0:39:39 - 0:39:42] ▶
We're using it as a tool, or also, you know, designing field experiments around it to
[0:39:42 - 0:39:46] ▶
understand, you know, under what conditions does it work?
[0:39:46 - 0:39:49] ▶
It's just as part of the team collecting rigorous data on these individuals.
[0:39:50 - 0:39:54] ▶
Like we're going to be collecting a lot of physiological data points on these individuals
[0:39:54 - 0:39:57] ▶
as they conduct these activities because that, that itself is almost a equally as important
[0:39:57 - 0:40:04] ▶
phenomenon to prove is real and to understand the nature of as the UAP phenomenon, right?
[0:40:04 - 0:40:10] ▶
So we have kind of two somewhat world-shaking propositions that we want to put to the test,
[0:40:10 - 0:40:15] ▶
And so, our anomalous phenomena are real in the sky, right?
[0:40:16 - 0:40:19] ▶
Highly anomalous, exotic objects or crafts or entities with, you know, a very, you
[0:40:19 - 0:40:25] ▶
know, nontrustural or prosaic morphologies.
[0:40:25 - 0:40:29] ▶
And they are their capacities of human beings that have not been fully appreciated.
[0:40:29 - 0:40:36] ▶
That can be relevant to understanding those UAP phenomena.
[0:40:36 - 0:40:39] ▶
Like those are two equally sort of groundbreaking questions.
[0:40:39 - 0:40:42] ▶
We're trying to collect data on them at the same time, right?
[0:40:42 - 0:40:45] ▶
So no small task, right?
[0:40:45 - 0:40:46] ▶
But you have a very high bar you're trying to clear.
[0:40:46 - 0:40:49] ▶
So you've talked about how the electro-mechanical signaling has had a 100% success rate in terms
[0:40:49 - 0:40:55] ▶
of manifesting, apparently manifesting the phenomenon.
[0:40:55 - 0:40:59] ▶
What are you seeing with the, what's this term again?
[0:40:59 - 0:41:05] ▶
The neuro, neuro, inconsecience.
[0:41:05 - 0:41:08] ▶
It just doesn't roll off the tongue like so.
[0:41:08 - 0:41:11] ▶
Neuro-meditative interaction.
[0:41:11 - 0:41:13] ▶
What are you seeing with neuro-meditative interaction?
[0:41:13 - 0:41:19] ▶
So I'll let Jake maybe follow up on that by.
[0:41:19 - 0:41:21] ▶
I'd say that there we rated as one level below in terms of the dog, what's in terms of the
[0:41:21 - 0:41:26] ▶
amount of comparable data we've been able to collect in the field.
[0:41:26 - 0:41:30] ▶
As you can imagine, human being is not like a machine you just flip a switch on, right?
[0:41:30 - 0:41:34] ▶
Like everyone has their own particular way of going about this sort of meditative protocols.
[0:41:34 - 0:41:40] ▶
Everyone has their own physiological states as they go throughout their operational activities.
[0:41:40 - 0:41:46] ▶
As you can speak to the two.
[0:41:46 - 0:41:50] ▶
But in general, your standards of evidence and your test protocols are going to be very
[0:41:50 - 0:41:55] ▶
different for a machine based phenomenon.
[0:41:55 - 0:41:59] ▶
You can just easily control.
[0:41:59 - 0:42:00] ▶
You can literally check their frequencies.
[0:42:00 - 0:42:02] ▶
You can do everything.
[0:42:02 - 0:42:03] ▶
And it's 100% the same every single time.
[0:42:03 - 0:42:05] ▶
Whereas the human being, the same person the next day is not just going to be the same
[0:42:05 - 0:42:09] ▶
person in terms of their wakefulness or whatever is going on in their environment.
[0:42:09 - 0:42:14] ▶
So this just takes a lot harder to generate the same degree of controlled consistent field
[0:42:14 - 0:42:20] ▶
But given that proviso, I'll just give the TLDR where we are now.
[0:42:21 - 0:42:26] ▶
Yeah, and it's more than just that because what we're finding again is not all nine classes
[0:42:26 - 0:42:32] ▶
are, we don't know what they are where they're coming from.
[0:42:32 - 0:42:36] ▶
There's probably three things going on.
[0:42:36 - 0:42:38] ▶
We call them buckets.
[0:42:38 - 0:42:39] ▶
Like there's probably a blue bucket, which is like advanced tech that's the good guys.
[0:42:39 - 0:42:47] ▶
Then there might be a red bucket.
[0:42:47 - 0:42:48] ▶
It might be Chinese or other.
[0:42:48 - 0:42:50] ▶
And then there's this other bucket, which we don't know where that stuff comes from.
[0:42:50 - 0:42:54] ▶
And we talk about this at length in episode two.
[0:42:54 - 0:42:57] ▶
But on the psionic side of things, they seem to be, this is where the positive and the
[0:42:57 - 0:43:04] ▶
negative information is valuable because the psionics sometimes on the detection side will
[0:43:04 - 0:43:10] ▶
We might have the dog whistle, have something show up and they, it's like dead to them.
[0:43:11 - 0:43:15] ▶
It's like it's an inanimate object to them where other classes induce a strong psionic
[0:43:15 - 0:43:21] ▶
response or reported anecdotal experience for the psionics.
[0:43:21 - 0:43:26] ▶
And that's more class based.
[0:43:26 - 0:43:28] ▶
So I can tell you more like the class nine, the egg seems to have a stronger correlation
[0:43:28 - 0:43:33] ▶
with our neural meditative process than say the class won't, the tick tack, I will tell
[0:43:33 - 0:43:39] ▶
So you are seeing a friend, the egg.
[0:43:40 - 0:43:43] ▶
You have seen the egg on the right.
[0:43:43 - 0:43:45] ▶
So the first two, the how we're going through this process, episode three that you'll see,
[0:43:45 - 0:43:52] ▶
we have seen in sky watch your episode one was a complete, we didn't use the dog whistle
[0:43:52 - 0:43:58] ▶
So the egg that you saw in episode one was a psionic, psionically elicited or it was based
[0:43:59 - 0:44:07] ▶
on that man calling protocol out on the range, the during episode two, which you're going
[0:44:07 - 0:44:14] ▶
to see on April 7th, that was all dog whistle.
[0:44:14 - 0:44:17] ▶
The psionics were there operating at night, but they were mostly used on the measurement side
[0:44:17 - 0:44:23] ▶
to see if what was, what the dog whistle gets to show up, which is a, is a lot of different
[0:44:23 - 0:44:30] ▶
What, what were the psionics sensing from that?
[0:44:32 - 0:44:35] ▶
Could they predict the arrival?
[0:44:35 - 0:44:37] ▶
Was there something that changed for them?
[0:44:37 - 0:44:40] ▶
Because they weren't, no, they are isolated from the operation where the dog whistle is being
[0:44:40 - 0:44:45] ▶
And so there's a bit of a control there.
[0:44:46 - 0:44:48] ▶
So we're trying to keep logs and record what the psionic team is experiencing in a, a
[0:44:48 - 0:44:57] ▶
pure environment like in a vacuum, if you will, and see if we can correlate the timing.
[0:44:57 - 0:45:03] ▶
The psionic team was able to predict some of the things we experienced in episode two that
[0:45:03 - 0:45:08] ▶
you'll see, but we aren't really testing for that.
[0:45:08 - 0:45:12] ▶
Now in episode three is going to be based, is going to, is going to be more focused on
[0:45:12 - 0:45:19] ▶
the man or the, the neural meditative summoning processes.
[0:45:19 - 0:45:23] ▶
So, can I be clear about this?
[0:45:23 - 0:45:26] ▶
When the psionics have been in operation recently when you're using the electro-mechanical signaling,
[0:45:26 - 0:45:32] ▶
you keep them separate, almost like a control.
[0:45:32 - 0:45:35] ▶
When they say, I appreciate that you're saying that they haven't detected all of the classes
[0:45:36 - 0:45:41] ▶
of object, but when they say they do detect an object, does that correlate with what you're
[0:45:41 - 0:45:47] ▶
detecting with your senses?
[0:45:47 - 0:45:51] ▶
Like they may say something like that something is going to show up at a certain time and there
[0:45:52 - 0:45:58] ▶
is going to be more than one.
[0:45:58 - 0:46:00] ▶
And this is some of the behavior that we think is going to take place when these two different
[0:46:00 - 0:46:06] ▶
And they've been able to...
[0:46:07 - 0:46:08] ▶
This is pre-cognitive, is it?
[0:46:08 - 0:46:10] ▶
It's going to happen.
[0:46:10 - 0:46:11] ▶
It's going to happen.
[0:46:11 - 0:46:12] ▶
And so, I'm with the whole psionics thing.
[0:46:14 - 0:46:17] ▶
It is a frontier on every level.
[0:46:17 - 0:46:20] ▶
Like there isn't a library or a reference of study here.
[0:46:20 - 0:46:26] ▶
Like no one has studied this in academia or otherwise, or those that have it's kept it very
[0:46:26 - 0:46:30] ▶
So, man, it's a lot of fun, but we're starting from scratch.
[0:46:31 - 0:46:37] ▶
And it's such a broad subject matter that finding a starting point is a challenge.
[0:46:37 - 0:46:48] ▶
So, right now, there's a lot of throwing spaghetti on the wall to see what sticks, especially
[0:46:48 - 0:46:53] ▶
with the psionic or neural meditative side of the house.
[0:46:53 - 0:46:57] ▶
It's also one that has, I would say, very different kind of moral and ethical gunrails around
[0:46:57 - 0:47:03] ▶
How we think about the human beings that are part of the team, what they're engaging
[0:47:05 - 0:47:09] ▶
in, what the nature of their intentions are, what the nature of the team's intentions
[0:47:09 - 0:47:13] ▶
This is an experimental activity, but it's guided by a very strong intentionality.
[0:47:14 - 0:47:20] ▶
That fundamentally is in good faith and is in the interest of open discovery and collaboration.
[0:47:20 - 0:47:27] ▶
I think this is the frontier.
[0:47:27 - 0:47:29] ▶
And there was inherent unknowns associated with engaging in exploratory research.
[0:47:29 - 0:47:37] ▶
But I think this is the part of the activity, the most, I think fraught in terms of people's
[0:47:37 - 0:47:41] ▶
People have lots of different interpretations of these types of activities, from the religious
[0:47:42 - 0:47:46] ▶
to the occult to pure psychic kind of neurophysiological research.
[0:47:46 - 0:47:52] ▶
And I think it's very important to understand there's a wide range of different perspectives
[0:47:52 - 0:47:56] ▶
people have on these types of activities, from the, it's nothing to like, you shouldn't
[0:47:56 - 0:48:01] ▶
even touch that, right?
[0:48:01 - 0:48:02] ▶
That's fundamentally demonic, right?
[0:48:02 - 0:48:04] ▶
And everywhere in between.
[0:48:04 - 0:48:05] ▶
And we don't take a view on any of that.
[0:48:05 - 0:48:07] ▶
We don't dismiss any of that, but we take a strong view that all of these activities need
[0:48:07 - 0:48:11] ▶
to be conducted with high integrity, positive intentions, and good faith and openness, right?
[0:48:11 - 0:48:17] ▶
And that doesn't necessarily ensure good outcomes.
[0:48:17 - 0:48:20] ▶
It just ensures at least that you can control what intentions you're bringing to the activity.
[0:48:20 - 0:48:25] ▶
Okay, so let's, let's go through a few of the questions that my audience are demanding.
[0:48:26 - 0:48:30] ▶
I find that from Skywatcher.
[0:48:30 - 0:48:33] ▶
And Jake, I've given you a heads up on this one.
[0:48:33 - 0:48:35] ▶
I mean, I think the biggest accusation that's leveled at you and Skywatcher is that this
[0:48:35 - 0:48:40] ▶
is all some CIA intelligence community front.
[0:48:40 - 0:48:45] ▶
And that what's going on here is Skywatcher is a way of the government slowly and slightly
[0:48:45 - 0:48:50] ▶
admitting what it's secretly been doing for decades.
[0:48:50 - 0:48:54] ▶
Is there any other question to answer?
[0:48:54 - 0:48:56] ▶
No, that that's, I mean, that's not not the case.
[0:48:56 - 0:49:02] ▶
I would say it's more to the contrary that we are getting, we are getting support from
[0:49:02 - 0:49:09] ▶
the government and all the places that we would like to get it, which has been refreshing.
[0:49:09 - 0:49:14] ▶
And we are, although the government is, is taking interest and is getting involved with
[0:49:14 - 0:49:20] ▶
us, we are in the driver's seat.
[0:49:20 - 0:49:23] ▶
They are not, they are not the solicitors of the cooperation that we are forming with
[0:49:23 - 0:49:29] ▶
Are they with you on the range?
[0:49:31 - 0:49:32] ▶
Like are you getting, for example, I mean, it would be my hope, for example, that
[0:49:32 - 0:49:37] ▶
arrows, the all-domain anomaly resolution office might be taking interest from the Pentagon's
[0:49:37 - 0:49:42] ▶
UAP investigation team.
[0:49:42 - 0:49:44] ▶
You know, the office of Arrow is, to me, it's one of the most exciting offices that
[0:49:45 - 0:49:53] ▶
the Defense Department has ever stood up.
[0:49:53 - 0:49:55] ▶
And in the spirit of that office, I'm really excited about it.
[0:49:55 - 0:49:58] ▶
And I really do hope that we can have the more functional and opening relationship with
[0:49:58 - 0:50:03] ▶
We are in communication with them.
[0:50:04 - 0:50:06] ▶
They have been, they have been on the range in the past with us.
[0:50:06 - 0:50:12] ▶
But they aren't the only ones that have an interest in this.
[0:50:12 - 0:50:15] ▶
There's a number of departments across government.
[0:50:15 - 0:50:19] ▶
And under the new administration, we've got a lot of positive, there's been a lot of
[0:50:19 - 0:50:24] ▶
positive interactions and a lot of plans for the future.
[0:50:24 - 0:50:29] ▶
And you'll learn more about that quickly.
[0:50:29 - 0:50:32] ▶
What we're doing, you have to forgive me, but we really want to allow anyone on the government
[0:50:32 - 0:50:37] ▶
side their own opportunity to discuss their involvement with this project on their own
[0:50:37 - 0:50:43] ▶
And I would expect to hear more about that in the future.
[0:50:44 - 0:50:47] ▶
Can I explore this with you, Jake?
[0:50:47 - 0:50:49] ▶
I'm increasingly coming to the view that it's completely wrong for us to perceive the
[0:50:49 - 0:50:56] ▶
whole government, the Defense and Intelligence community as one amorphous blob that is antagonistically
[0:50:56 - 0:51:02] ▶
opposed to any kind of disclosure on the phenomenon.
[0:51:02 - 0:51:06] ▶
Yeah, I'm happy with that.
[0:51:06 - 0:51:07] ▶
There are people in Defense and Intelligence who want this story told.
[0:51:07 - 0:51:10] ▶
And I get the impression they see Skywatcher as a vehicle to achieve that.
[0:51:11 - 0:51:15] ▶
And I hope for that.
[0:51:16 - 0:51:17] ▶
I hope we allow certain parts of the government to a path forward to get them out of the corners
[0:51:17 - 0:51:27] ▶
that they've painted themselves in.
[0:51:27 - 0:51:30] ▶
And again, there is no real vague.
[0:51:30 - 0:51:31] ▶
I mean, anyone that's not completely naive can tell if you haven't been living in a cave
[0:51:31 - 0:51:37] ▶
the last five years that the government is not this big cohesive, cooperative body and
[0:51:37 - 0:51:44] ▶
even all the offices within.
[0:51:44 - 0:51:46] ▶
It's a group of individuals just like us.
[0:51:46 - 0:51:49] ▶
And individuals have their own human instincts and motivations and their 10 year of variety
[0:51:49 - 0:51:55] ▶
And you end up with a unified message or intent or policy in that regard.
[0:51:56 - 0:52:02] ▶
So I'll tell you in a whole, generally speaking, we're really encouraged.
[0:52:02 - 0:52:09] ▶
You know, the men in black have not showed up.
[0:52:09 - 0:52:12] ▶
I've never seen them out there.
[0:52:12 - 0:52:13] ▶
No one's telling us, stop doing what you're doing.
[0:52:13 - 0:52:17] ▶
We've given, we've been very open and transparent, made multiple trips on a regular basis to
[0:52:17 - 0:52:22] ▶
DC, meaning with Congress and a number of other departments and have been very forthcoming
[0:52:22 - 0:52:28] ▶
with what we're doing, what our success has been and what our intentions are.
[0:52:28 - 0:52:32] ▶
And we're getting, you know, nothing but support.
[0:52:32 - 0:52:34] ▶
No one's telling us, stop.
[0:52:34 - 0:52:36] ▶
And no one's showing up trying to shut us down.
[0:52:36 - 0:52:40] ▶
So that's the next question, of course, is what do you do if the men in black have
[0:52:40 - 0:52:43] ▶
black do turn up and say, look, for national security reasons, we're not going to let you
[0:52:43 - 0:52:48] ▶
continue doing this?
[0:52:48 - 0:52:49] ▶
Well, if that happens, you all will know about it because the cameras will be rolling
[0:52:49 - 0:52:54] ▶
and we're certainly going to share that.
[0:52:54 - 0:52:56] ▶
I don't expect that to happen.
[0:52:56 - 0:52:58] ▶
But if it does happen, it's not going to happen in secret and you have my word on that.
[0:52:58 - 0:53:04] ▶
So one of the things that I think it's important to give you the opportunity to clarify this.
[0:53:04 - 0:53:08] ▶
In your document that you've got the framework document that you're releasing in a few days,
[0:53:08 - 0:53:13] ▶
you say that due to national security considerations, we must ensure that we're not inadvertently
[0:53:13 - 0:53:19] ▶
disclosing any information that could compromise classified US government capabilities or sensor
[0:53:19 - 0:53:26] ▶
Now, I know there's a bit of ambiguity in that statement.
[0:53:27 - 0:53:30] ▶
You're not saying there that you're going to collaborate with the government to censor
[0:53:30 - 0:53:34] ▶
But you are saying that if you inadvertently, for example, detect, say, I'll let's say
[0:53:36 - 0:53:42] ▶
a new type of fighter or some new craft that the United States is working on, you would
[0:53:42 - 0:53:48] ▶
respect the national security constraints on that.
[0:53:48 - 0:53:50] ▶
Yeah, that's what it says.
[0:53:54 - 0:53:55] ▶
Yeah, so we are not looking for prior restraint from the government to go through our data
[0:53:55 - 0:53:59] ▶
sets and say, this is permissible.
[0:53:59 - 0:54:02] ▶
But if it's a platform that some members of the team are aware of already, that is US
[0:54:02 - 0:54:07] ▶
government platform, it's irresponsible for us to just release information that we think
[0:54:07 - 0:54:11] ▶
would harm national security without furthering any public interest objectives.
[0:54:11 - 0:54:15] ▶
You guys are patriots.
[0:54:16 - 0:54:17] ▶
You're not about to compromise something that gives America an advantage.
[0:54:18 - 0:54:22] ▶
Yeah, we're interested in scientific discovery of anomalous phenomena, right?
[0:54:22 - 0:54:28] ▶
We're not looking to publish images for some aviation weekly cover page on some next generation
[0:54:28 - 0:54:37] ▶
US government platform.
[0:54:37 - 0:54:39] ▶
But Jake, you and I both know that behind all of this is the reality that there's a legacy
[0:54:39 - 0:54:45] ▶
program and whatever it's been doing with the technology it's been recovering, it's obviously
[0:54:45 - 0:54:51] ▶
been trying to reverse engineer it.
[0:54:51 - 0:54:53] ▶
And there is, I suspect, a probability, if not a likelihood, that the United States,
[0:54:53 - 0:54:59] ▶
even though the Pentagon officially denies all of this, there is a probability or a likelihood
[0:54:59 - 0:55:04] ▶
that the United States is actually working with this technology.
[0:55:04 - 0:55:09] ▶
What if there is craft that are being operated by the United States?
[0:55:09 - 0:55:14] ▶
I mean, it's a hypothetical I appreciate, which are retrieved non-human craft.
[0:55:14 - 0:55:19] ▶
I know that's been speculated about quite recently, that we may have learned the ability
[0:55:19 - 0:55:24] ▶
to perhaps, silently operate or neuromedicatively operate these craft.
[0:55:24 - 0:55:30] ▶
Do you sense of that?
[0:55:30 - 0:55:32] ▶
Do you hide that from the public if that's what's discovered?
[0:55:32 - 0:55:37] ▶
I think you have to be careful what you wish for.
[0:55:37 - 0:55:39] ▶
I think that when you are altruistically patriotic and altruistically concerned for national
[0:55:39 - 0:55:46] ▶
security, even in the lack in a situation where there's a lack of guidance on how we
[0:55:46 - 0:55:54] ▶
should proceed with our data, that burden still falls on us.
[0:55:54 - 0:55:57] ▶
I'm none of us on our team are going to go, well, they didn't tell us we can't show
[0:55:57 - 0:56:02] ▶
So we're going to cast it out there.
[0:56:03 - 0:56:04] ▶
So we are taking every precaution we can.
[0:56:04 - 0:56:07] ▶
If we see something that looks like the F-48, we've just been briefed on the F-47, we're
[0:56:07 - 0:56:16] ▶
going to push hard and there's no good reason.
[0:56:16 - 0:56:18] ▶
And honestly, there's way more interesting things going on than something like that.
[0:56:18 - 0:56:22] ▶
So that's again, why a true patriot, someone who's truly concerned with national security,
[0:56:22 - 0:56:31] ▶
is not going to be irresponsible even in the lack of leadership and oversight.
[0:56:31 - 0:56:37] ▶
The other thing that people have jumped on is I think in one of your original videos,
[0:56:37 - 0:56:41] ▶
there was an image, a cat away of a machine gun, I think a 50 caliber machine gun.
[0:56:41 - 0:56:47] ▶
First of all, it's for self-defense.
[0:56:53 - 0:56:57] ▶
We are very safety and defense oriented and safety and self-defense is paramount.
[0:56:57 - 0:57:03] ▶
And it's the platform that allows everybody to do their job stress-free.
[0:57:03 - 0:57:09] ▶
So again, within the constraints of what you're allowed to tell me, would you ever use any
[0:57:09 - 0:57:17] ▶
kind of offensive weaponry, be it conventional say a machine gun or a rocket launcher or
[0:57:17 - 0:57:23] ▶
a high pulse microwave weapon to down a non-human craft?
[0:57:23 - 0:57:28] ▶
No, and that's highly illegal.
[0:57:28 - 0:57:30] ▶
Everything we do is done in accordance with our FAA and FCC operational, what's called
[0:57:30 - 0:57:37] ▶
And we don't do anything illegal out there.
[0:57:39 - 0:57:42] ▶
But the self-defense aspect, I guess that's too prompt.
[0:57:42 - 0:57:48] ▶
One of the things you might be worried about is a foreign adversary nation taking a very
[0:57:48 - 0:57:51] ▶
close interest in the work that you're doing, and that's why obviously you're operating
[0:57:51 - 0:57:55] ▶
to a degree covertly.
[0:57:55 - 0:57:58] ▶
But the other thing I can anticipate that you might be concerned about is that if these
[0:57:58 - 0:58:03] ▶
are non-human craft, they might not be very happy with being invited or summoned or whatever
[0:58:03 - 0:58:10] ▶
it is that happens when you use the electro-mechanical signaling or the neuro-meditative interaction.
[0:58:10 - 0:58:17] ▶
Is that those two scenarios what you're thinking of with defensive weaponry?
[0:58:17 - 0:58:23] ▶
No, I can't imagine that the latter.
[0:58:23 - 0:58:26] ▶
First of all, to even get to that conversation, we're accepting the fact that NHI exists
[0:58:26 - 0:58:33] ▶
and that aliens exist.
[0:58:33 - 0:58:35] ▶
Most of the people that are putting this argument, I don't think it's a genuine argument or
[0:58:35 - 0:58:40] ▶
First of all, speculation is to why people, anyone that has a weapon out there is an experienced
[0:58:41 - 0:58:46] ▶
qualified operator and is responsible and understands rules of engagement.
[0:58:46 - 0:58:51] ▶
That's not why we're here.
[0:58:51 - 0:58:53] ▶
I would have to imagine that if someone was to do that, it'd be like taking a knife to
[0:58:53 - 0:58:58] ▶
You're going to lose.
[0:58:59 - 0:59:00] ▶
I can't imagine anything we have would compete with something on that level.
[0:59:00 - 0:59:05] ▶
The last thing we want to do is act aggressively.
[0:59:05 - 0:59:08] ▶
As Matt talked about, intention is huge for us.
[0:59:08 - 0:59:11] ▶
It's not just for the neuro-meditators or the psionic assets.
[0:59:11 - 0:59:15] ▶
One on the team and everyone that is on the team has been selected for not only their
[0:59:15 - 0:59:23] ▶
skills that they're contributing, but their intent and their spiritual orientation.
[0:59:23 - 0:59:27] ▶
Our primary barrier for entry is that intent for all members on the team.
[0:59:27 - 0:59:32] ▶
I don't care if you're cleaning the sky watch or toilet or you're running the dog whistle,
[0:59:32 - 0:59:35] ▶
you have to be pure of heart.
[0:59:35 - 0:59:38] ▶
We actually have a written oath.
[0:59:38 - 0:59:41] ▶
It's a beautiful oath and maybe we'll publish it.
[0:59:41 - 0:59:43] ▶
It's a 500 word oath that talks about the purity of our intentions.
[0:59:43 - 0:59:47] ▶
We actually set intentions every day before operations and at the end of operations.
[0:59:47 - 0:59:53] ▶
It's quite a beautiful thing because that combined intention.
[0:59:53 - 0:59:58] ▶
Let's just remove the fact that we are playing with something that borderlines on metaphysical.
[0:59:58 - 1:00:03] ▶
If you were doing any job, if you showed up to a construction site with a bunch of contractors
[1:00:03 - 1:00:08] ▶
and you were going to build a house, I think it would be a pretty effective thing for
[1:00:08 - 1:00:12] ▶
synergy and teamwork to combine your effort and to do something like a prayer that
[1:00:12 - 1:00:19] ▶
orients everyone and connects everyone together.
[1:00:19 - 1:00:22] ▶
It's very functional from a work ethic standpoint and it's the cornerstone of our operations.
[1:00:22 - 1:00:31] ▶
The people who I know who are psionic or purport to have psionic abilities,
[1:00:31 - 1:00:36] ▶
neuro-meditative interaction abilities, they tell me that you're right.
[1:00:36 - 1:00:41] ▶
That intention indeed, an expression of love, it's corny as that sounds, is actually incredibly important
[1:00:41 - 1:00:50] ▶
because the phenomenon can reflect back at you what you are.
[1:00:50 - 1:00:54] ▶
I know from people who've been to the Skinwalker Ranch, which is another site in Utah
[1:00:54 - 1:01:00] ▶
where there is alleged anomalous phenomena, the people who have been in combat or in near-death situations.
[1:01:00 - 1:01:08] ▶
They often have quite horrific experiences that the phenomenon seems to reflect back at them
[1:01:08 - 1:01:14] ▶
something about their own life experience.
[1:01:14 - 1:01:16] ▶
Is that something you're seeing on the range?
[1:01:16 - 1:01:20] ▶
Seeing is yet to be determined.
[1:01:20 - 1:01:24] ▶
We certainly feel that way.
[1:01:24 - 1:01:26] ▶
Again, it's something why we've established this framework.
[1:01:26 - 1:01:29] ▶
It's something that we would love to prove because how amazing would that be if we could prove scientifically
[1:01:29 - 1:01:36] ▶
and get to level six where we have full disclosure and integration of this particular hypothesis right here
[1:01:36 - 1:01:45] ▶
that intention matters.
[1:01:45 - 1:01:47] ▶
Talk about, now, do you want the Defense Department?
[1:01:47 - 1:01:50] ▶
This is a good example of why we shouldn't burden them with figuring this out for us.
[1:01:50 - 1:01:56] ▶
That's huge. That's a really exciting thing.
[1:01:56 - 1:02:01] ▶
Matt, you talk in the framework document about the importance of getting independent review, independent verification.
[1:02:01 - 1:02:12] ▶
Are you able to tell me who you're planning on using?
[1:02:12 - 1:02:14] ▶
What scientific body would you use to get independent verification?
[1:02:14 - 1:02:18] ▶
We haven't selected a single group or sort of knighted a particular partner organization.
[1:02:18 - 1:02:25] ▶
I think there's lots of folks out there that we would provide an invitation to to assess different parts of our analysis
[1:02:25 - 1:02:32] ▶
depending on their expertise.
[1:02:32 - 1:02:33] ▶
There's going to be a lot of complicated data that we're collecting that is quite technical
[1:02:33 - 1:02:38] ▶
in terms of its radar, EOIR, and collating and integrating that type of technical data to the point where
[1:02:38 - 1:02:45] ▶
you can get an independent peer review assessment of our findings.
[1:02:45 - 1:02:49] ▶
You're not just going to find those things by whacking a tree.
[1:02:50 - 1:02:54] ▶
We're going to take invitations from folks that are interested and so folks that want to get involved
[1:02:54 - 1:02:59] ▶
in potentially bringing those different skills to bear will have ways of engaging with us.
[1:02:59 - 1:03:07] ▶
We're going to be publishing the papers that we intend to write on public repositories like archives,
[1:03:07 - 1:03:14] ▶
which is where you post pre-publication drafts of papers.
[1:03:15 - 1:03:21] ▶
And the typical scientific method is you have interesting results.
[1:03:21 - 1:03:24] ▶
You write it up into paper, you publish the paper.
[1:03:24 - 1:03:27] ▶
It's now anyone can download it and can produce their own rebuttal or their own critique.
[1:03:27 - 1:03:32] ▶
And then you respond to those critiques and ultimately if you feel like you've gotten to the point
[1:03:32 - 1:03:38] ▶
where you've checked all the different possible objections, you try to get it published.
[1:03:38 - 1:03:42] ▶
We're going to try to pursue the serious scientific track for the scientific hypotheses that we're looking to test
[1:03:42 - 1:03:47] ▶
as well as, but a lot of people aren't going to read technical papers,
[1:03:48 - 1:03:52] ▶
as well as produce more consumable content that allows people to understand the journey that we're
[1:03:52 - 1:03:58] ▶
on trying to bring this information out to the public. But we're looking for folks that have
[1:03:58 - 1:04:04] ▶
specialized skills to assess this type of data. And what we have in pick like a particular group
[1:04:04 - 1:04:11] ▶
that's going to be the chosen third party. But there are others out there that we might engage.
[1:04:11 - 1:04:17] ▶
Jake, when you and I first met, one of the things you told me, and I remember thinking this is
[1:04:18 - 1:04:22] ▶
just off planet stuff, it sounded crazy, but you're actually doing it.
[1:04:22 - 1:04:27] ▶
You talk to me about the idea that we don't need to get government verification of the phenomenon
[1:04:28 - 1:04:35] ▶
that good science can prove what you suspect or know to be the case, that there is this phenomenon
[1:04:35 - 1:04:41] ▶
that can be independently verified. At the heart of what you were telling me though,
[1:04:41 - 1:04:46] ▶
was the intention to ultimately invite a craft to land. Are you still planning to do that?
[1:04:46 - 1:04:55] ▶
We're certainly open to it. We would love that if that happened. I mean,
[1:04:56 - 1:05:00] ▶
getting to experience exotic material would be amazing. I think that would be,
[1:05:02 - 1:05:07] ▶
I think everybody wants that. And yeah, it would be nice to have government involvement.
[1:05:08 - 1:05:14] ▶
But this isn't just in this realm. There's the private sector and there's the government sector.
[1:05:14 - 1:05:21] ▶
And we've seen how each of those sectors has handled a variety of goods and services
[1:05:21 - 1:05:28] ▶
and has produced things. And there's pros and cons to each, whether you're trying to
[1:05:28 - 1:05:32] ▶
build a bridge or manage a department of administration for some function. And it's the same
[1:05:33 - 1:05:41] ▶
in this realm. It's unavoidable. Again, we're doing everything legally. I've
[1:05:41 - 1:05:49] ▶
tell you, everyone on our team, before they come and work for us, I kind of make this promise
[1:05:49 - 1:05:53] ▶
when we're looking to hire people. I go, look, we'd love to have you. Here's what we're doing.
[1:05:53 - 1:05:59] ▶
These are the four pillars that drive our decision making on what kind of projects we're going to
[1:05:59 - 1:06:03] ▶
take on. First of all, it needs to be legal. It needs to be safe. It needs to be fun. And it needs
[1:06:03 - 1:06:09] ▶
to be profitable. Now, that last one profit, this thing costs money. Like we are asking a lot,
[1:06:09 - 1:06:15] ▶
and we respect the people that work for us. We don't expect them to come work for free. This can't
[1:06:15 - 1:06:19] ▶
be done in part time. You can't sacrifice your weekly golf round and come join us for that. We take
[1:06:19 - 1:06:26] ▶
this seriously. We're fortunate enough to have folks provide us the financing in order to operate
[1:06:26 - 1:06:32] ▶
on a humble budget and stretch this out as long as we can so we could get to level six in our framework.
[1:06:32 - 1:06:37] ▶
But to have the right balance between the government and private, that's why since the very
[1:06:38 - 1:06:43] ▶
beginning, we've talked about a public private partnership. And that's ultimately where we would like
[1:06:43 - 1:06:49] ▶
to get with this because, yeah, you could do this without the government to a certain extent,
[1:06:49 - 1:06:54] ▶
but you can't do it entirely without them. And why would we want to? The government is needs to be
[1:06:54 - 1:07:03] ▶
in place. And I'd rather just improve upon the relationship rather than do without it.
[1:07:03 - 1:07:09] ▶
You know, there's a lot of things that you've said today that I think a lot of our audience are
[1:07:10 - 1:07:14] ▶
going to find absolutely exciting and mind-blowing. But I think the one thing that's in your report
[1:07:14 - 1:07:19] ▶
in the framework document that really leapt out at me is that you make a very bold claim
[1:07:19 - 1:07:24] ▶
that by following the framework's six levels, Sky Watcher will either validate or definitively
[1:07:25 - 1:07:31] ▶
rule out these techniques, that is, electro-mechanical signaling or neuro-meditative interaction,
[1:07:31 - 1:07:38] ▶
reaching a conclusive determination by the end of 2025. What the applications of that are,
[1:07:39 - 1:07:46] ▶
correct me if I'm wrong, you will, by the end of this year, you predict, know whether it is possible
[1:07:46 - 1:07:53] ▶
to electro-mechanically or neuro-meditatively invite a non-human intelligence to engage with humanity.
[1:07:53 - 1:08:04] ▶
Yeah, I would say, Matt, you could, I'll do a quick answer and you can take over, but I would say,
[1:08:06 - 1:08:11] ▶
based on our progress so far and the framework we've set out, I think, and how much
[1:08:11 - 1:08:18] ▶
we've made so far, I think greater things have been done in a less amount of time, so it seems like
[1:08:18 - 1:08:24] ▶
a very practical goal, and we're not afraid to set that target and go for it. I think goal orientation
[1:08:24 - 1:08:30] ▶
is important. Yeah, it seems it sounds a bit absurd, I think, only because nobody's tried it,
[1:08:30 - 1:08:38] ▶
right? So the good thing is this is sort of open field running for this team, and the first few
[1:08:38 - 1:08:47] ▶
runs, they've got pretty far down the field. And so yeah, I think we're not letting our
[1:08:47 - 1:08:51] ▶
foot off the gas, like we want to continue to refine, expand, improve the operations, the
[1:08:51 - 1:08:57] ▶
rigor of the experiments, you know, the first two were essentially learning trials, right? I think
[1:08:57 - 1:09:02] ▶
now we're hitting our stride, and I think we're already going to see quite dramatic shifts in the
[1:09:02 - 1:09:07] ▶
level of of information we're able to collect, and so I think it's not an unreasonable extrapolation
[1:09:07 - 1:09:12] ▶
to also set a target on range for us to aim at, right? Like this shouldn't be like an indefinite
[1:09:13 - 1:09:20] ▶
activity, like that goes on for a year after year after year, and we keep moving the goal posts,
[1:09:20 - 1:09:24] ▶
right? And it becomes this kind of thing, right? We want to make a clear statement, we want to
[1:09:24 - 1:09:29] ▶
achieve a certain level of confidence, we want to achieve a certain level of high confidence in
[1:09:29 - 1:09:34] ▶
the data that we're gathering, and we want to share that with the public as soon as possible,
[1:09:34 - 1:09:38] ▶
to resolve these questions as quickly as possible, right? We have no interest in just having
[1:09:38 - 1:09:43] ▶
this be an indefinite thing, like we want to get to a conclusion, we want to get to a resolution
[1:09:43 - 1:09:49] ▶
on at least some of these questions, right? I think a lot of these questions that are going to
[1:09:50 - 1:09:52] ▶
then be opened up are going to take a lot longer to resolve, but I think that's where we want to
[1:09:52 - 1:09:57] ▶
shift the conversation as quickly as possible. I truly believe that regardless of where we are
[1:09:57 - 1:10:05] ▶
at the end of 2025, when discovery comes and when a level six disclosure happens, which I believe
[1:10:05 - 1:10:13] ▶
wholeheartedly it will, we will look back on our effort in 2025 as Skywatcher, and it will be the
[1:10:13 - 1:10:21] ▶
starting point and it should be revered as the launch point from for how we got to level six
[1:10:21 - 1:10:29] ▶
and how others will have gotten there if they beat us to it.
[1:10:29 - 1:10:32] ▶
Gentlemen, I want to put this in its context. If you pull this off, this is a scientific
[1:10:33 - 1:10:42] ▶
exploration achievement that I think overshadows humanity's greatest-ever achievements. I mean,
[1:10:42 - 1:10:49] ▶
this would be one of the defining moments in human history, wouldn't it?
[1:10:49 - 1:10:53] ▶
That's a heavy thing to take to heart, but I agree with you, but I just would say that
[1:10:54 - 1:11:03] ▶
part of why I think we are able to make the progress we have and are going to make is being done
[1:11:04 - 1:11:10] ▶
on the backs and shoulders of people that have created technology and educational references
[1:11:10 - 1:11:20] ▶
for us to even do this type of experimentation to begin with. Even just the camera technology,
[1:11:20 - 1:11:25] ▶
radar technology, all the scientists that are coming to help us out are bringing with them
[1:11:25 - 1:11:31] ▶
things that weren't available even five, ten years ago. So for us to take credit for that,
[1:11:32 - 1:11:37] ▶
we're more like my good friend Don Paul says, we're like the reverse
[1:11:37 - 1:11:42] ▶
prism, if you will, that takes refractive light or takes a light beam and turns it into a rainbow.
[1:11:44 - 1:11:48] ▶
We're doing the opposite. We're taking all the colors of the rainbow, concentrating them
[1:11:48 - 1:11:53] ▶
and turning them into a concentrated beam of light. And I think that's kind of, if we get there,
[1:11:53 - 1:11:59] ▶
we were just the group that came along and was able to take all of these resources and direct
[1:12:00 - 1:12:07] ▶
them and apply them to this subject and this question and these hypotheses in order to reach that
[1:12:07 - 1:12:13] ▶
conclusion. You have a sense of history here. I'm interested in getting your personal emotional
[1:12:13 - 1:12:21] ▶
reaction to what you're involved in. I mean, if you pull this off, this is history, isn't it?
[1:12:21 - 1:12:26] ▶
I mean, yes, in a certain sense, I also think there's a certain amount of an
[1:12:27 - 1:12:32] ▶
inevitability associated with this. Right? Like I think there are an increasingly large number
[1:12:32 - 1:12:40] ▶
of individuals in and out of the government that are aware of the reality of this phenomenon.
[1:12:40 - 1:12:45] ▶
Right? So as if there was a secret group of scientists that had already made a discovery by
[1:12:45 - 1:12:52] ▶
sending submersibles down to the Marriott's trench and had discovered a bunch of exotic jellyfish
[1:12:52 - 1:13:00] ▶
living 30,000 feet down. And they had written secret reports to each other. They had collected samples.
[1:13:00 - 1:13:06] ▶
And so it was a fact for those individuals. Right? And then James Cameron comes along and builds
[1:13:06 - 1:13:12] ▶
a submersible and brings a film crew and goes down to the depths and takes pictures, maybe even
[1:13:12 - 1:13:18] ▶
collects some samples and brings it back for the rest of the scientific community. You would
[1:13:18 - 1:13:22] ▶
handle that as a massive discovery, but in a certain sense, it was already known to be true.
[1:13:22 - 1:13:27] ▶
Right? It's just what matters, though, for the rest of our society is not like discovery as a
[1:13:27 - 1:13:33] ▶
social process. Right? Discovery requires people accepting that thing is true. Right? And I run
[1:13:33 - 1:13:39] ▶
through this hypothetical, or say that we do retrieve exotic materials. Right? Say we do get,
[1:13:39 - 1:13:44] ▶
you know, intact craft of some kind or some exotic biologic or whatever it is.
[1:13:44 - 1:13:49] ▶
That doesn't immediately just flip everyone's opinion overnight. Right? You still have to do science.
[1:13:50 - 1:13:54] ▶
You still have to prove is this thing, which looks really weird or looks apparently highly
[1:13:54 - 1:14:00] ▶
anomalous and comes in at all these different video streams and radar and then we've got it up close.
[1:14:00 - 1:14:06] ▶
Well, you're still going to have to answer the, well, that's just CGI. That's just styrofoam.
[1:14:06 - 1:14:11] ▶
That's just a bunch of, you know, like, glock that they threw down onto the desert floor. Right?
[1:14:11 - 1:14:17] ▶
You're going to have to bring in scientists. You have to bring individuals to study the material.
[1:14:17 - 1:14:21] ▶
You're going to have to have the most advanced equipment prove the material isn't known of known,
[1:14:21 - 1:14:26] ▶
you know, means of human manufacturer isn't associated with the phylogenic tree of other biological
[1:14:26 - 1:14:32] ▶
creatures. So just because you get material doesn't mean science. And usually that's actually
[1:14:32 - 1:14:36] ▶
when the most important science starts. And the process of quote, like disclosure that social
[1:14:36 - 1:14:40] ▶
integration is going to be a process. And I think this is where it won't be like the light switch
[1:14:40 - 1:14:45] ▶
that flips on. I think there will be a bunch of, uh-huh. What's that moments? But I think the process
[1:14:45 - 1:14:50] ▶
of recognition of the significance of this will, will take a lot of time to settle in. But I think
[1:14:50 - 1:14:56] ▶
the most important part of it though is that there's a lot of information, at least from my,
[1:14:56 - 1:15:00] ▶
from my perspective, that exists on this subject. So it's a process both of discovery,
[1:15:00 - 1:15:05] ▶
but that the ideally is that the discovery catalyzes disclosure, right? And that builds a bridge
[1:15:05 - 1:15:11] ▶
between the public and the private sectors to get more of the sort of larger context for this
[1:15:11 - 1:15:17] ▶
subject into the public domain. And that can't come from us, right? They can't come all from us.
[1:15:17 - 1:15:22] ▶
Like we have our specific mission is to collect this data, to bring it to the public,
[1:15:22 - 1:15:27] ▶
and to provide, you know, a clear accounting and, and, you know, a storyline as we go about this
[1:15:27 - 1:15:33] ▶
process. But as me, we're going to answer everything, right? We don't have the, we don't have the
[1:15:33 - 1:15:37] ▶
final sort of sort of word here, right? We're not going to be bringing, you know, the truth down from
[1:15:37 - 1:15:42] ▶
the mantle, uh, or from the mountaintops, right? That's built into our framework. That's already
[1:15:42 - 1:15:48] ▶
built into our discovery framework. Right? Level four is, uh, is what an independent verification
[1:15:48 - 1:15:54] ▶
and peer review, that's already there. And that starts over again when we get something to the ground,
[1:15:54 - 1:16:00] ▶
we go back through that process. And, and interpretation of, of sciences, still a very fraught matter,
[1:16:00 - 1:16:06] ▶
right? Like there's, um, there's usually very little in the way of consensus on lots of things
[1:16:06 - 1:16:12] ▶
in scientific community, even on things that are proven to be real phenomenon, right? It takes a
[1:16:12 - 1:16:17] ▶
lot of work to understand, well, what is it? Right? What's its nature? Right? How does it work? Where does
[1:16:17 - 1:16:21] ▶
it come from? These are ultimately the questions people want answers to. And I know that's going to be a
[1:16:21 - 1:16:25] ▶
much longer journey of analysis and partnership that's going to require a lot of resources and a lot of
[1:16:25 - 1:16:30] ▶
capabilities that span far beyond Skywarcher. But it's, it's the ambition we want to set, right? It's the,
[1:16:30 - 1:16:35] ▶
we want to start having that conversation. And by treating this with rigor and professionalism,
[1:16:35 - 1:16:39] ▶
bring in experts from across these different disciplines, right? That now, now have to perk up and
[1:16:39 - 1:16:45] ▶
bring their, their attention and their skills to the subject. And I think that is really,
[1:16:45 - 1:16:50] ▶
I think the most significant historical inflection for me will be the result of these efforts is by
[1:16:50 - 1:16:56] ▶
providing that locus point where you provide, this is actually real phenomenon here. We've got the
[1:16:56 - 1:17:00] ▶
data now coming study it, right? And now there's a, there's an anchor point. There's a locus around which
[1:17:00 - 1:17:05] ▶
other communities of practice and other expertise can, can, can flow in. And that can, then, hopefully,
[1:17:05 - 1:17:10] ▶
catalyze something quite transformative. Jake, I would be remiss if I didn't ask you about
[1:17:10 - 1:17:16] ▶
something that Dr. Professor Gary Nolan said a couple of days ago. He, he, he did an interview and
[1:17:16 - 1:17:22] ▶
he said that Skywarcher observed unexplained things that moved in anomalous ways during the
[1:17:22 - 1:17:29] ▶
New Jersey drone wave. When you have drones coming in from the ocean, he said, and then returning to
[1:17:29 - 1:17:36] ▶
the ocean, that's not hobbyist drones. And did you, did you get the impression that some of what you
[1:17:36 - 1:17:43] ▶
saw when you were observing over Picatinny Arsenal during the December period force guy,
[1:17:43 - 1:17:50] ▶
what, did you get the impression that what you were seeing was anomalous at times?
[1:17:50 - 1:17:54] ▶
Yeah, it certainly meant like those first two levels of framework for us. We didn't, we were in
[1:17:54 - 1:18:00] ▶
New Jersey for a very short amount of time about a week. On the first two, two or three days of,
[1:18:00 - 1:18:05] ▶
we, we got a lot of information, but the weather came in and it really inhibited us to move to the
[1:18:06 - 1:18:12] ▶
higher levels. It was a pretty chaotic situation, but I can tell you that what we did see went out
[1:18:12 - 1:18:19] ▶
there. Did was not all explained or explainable by, by what we're hearing. The, I worked very
[1:18:19 - 1:18:30] ▶
closely with the FAA during that time. The FAA wasn't, how do I say this? They weren't aware of,
[1:18:30 - 1:18:42] ▶
and weren't in communication and controlled with the craft that we're flying there. And also,
[1:18:42 - 1:18:48] ▶
not all the things that, that, that, it's a very busy airspace out there. So yes, most of what
[1:18:48 - 1:18:55] ▶
you see flying in the air around that area is airplanes and maybe some other drones, but
[1:18:55 - 1:19:02] ▶
that's not what, we're, that's not what the focus is. There's a large category of things that we're
[1:19:03 - 1:19:08] ▶
flying in the air. I'll just say illegally and didn't look like your typical craft and they were
[1:19:08 - 1:19:17] ▶
coming from a variety of directions. These are all things people have heard before already, but,
[1:19:17 - 1:19:22] ▶
you know, either turning their lights on and off or disappearing and appearing and also coming
[1:19:22 - 1:19:27] ▶
from a variety of directions, which included it out over the ocean, which is one of the, one of the
[1:19:27 - 1:19:33] ▶
observation posts that we held when we were out there. So basically, the official word still from
[1:19:33 - 1:19:40] ▶
the White House is that these drones over New Jersey, supposed drones, were FAA authorized drones.
[1:19:40 - 1:19:48] ▶
On the basis of what you're saying, there, these objects were anomalous and they were not known by
[1:19:48 - 1:19:55] ▶
the FAA. Yeah, I, I would say that statement is true, but it doesn't account for all the things
[1:19:55 - 1:20:02] ▶
that were in the air over New Jersey or for that matter. Any of the other geographical locations
[1:20:02 - 1:20:09] ▶
that we're having similar incursions? It does lend to the suspicion and I'm not trying to draw
[1:20:09 - 1:20:15] ▶
you into the controversy here, but it does lend to this. No, no, but it does lend to the, I mean, there's
[1:20:15 - 1:20:20] ▶
an obvious contradiction at the moment between what the White House has said that the objects over
[1:20:20 - 1:20:25] ▶
New Jersey or FAA authorized drones and the fact that people are still reporting these objects and
[1:20:25 - 1:20:31] ▶
it just struck me that it's something that Skywatch could play a really important role in helping
[1:20:31 - 1:20:37] ▶
resolve. Is that something that Skywatch would like to get involved in? Is, is figuring out the
[1:20:37 - 1:20:42] ▶
mystery of what these anomalous objects are that are apparently still are showing themselves
[1:20:42 - 1:20:47] ▶
over parts of the East Coast in particular? Well, I would say there's only so much time in the day,
[1:20:47 - 1:20:52] ▶
Ross, like we, we all have to get our sleep and brush our teeth and go to the mailbox. I don't know
[1:20:52 - 1:20:58] ▶
with our team right now that we even have the bandwidth of time to do that, but ultimately if there
[1:20:58 - 1:21:03] ▶
was an organized interest in our participation in helping to look into that issue, of course,
[1:21:03 - 1:21:10] ▶
we would like the opportunity, but right now we're pretty busy. I mean, in general, right? So we're
[1:21:10 - 1:21:17] ▶
focused on scientific discovery. We're setting up controlled field experiments. The equipment,
[1:21:17 - 1:21:22] ▶
though, that we're using in the skills and expertise of the team is like 100% transformable to,
[1:21:22 - 1:21:27] ▶
you know, normal counter-UES domains, which is exactly why they were deployed. And so they have
[1:21:28 - 1:21:33] ▶
the capabilities, the discernment, the analytical expertise to support those types of activities.
[1:21:33 - 1:21:39] ▶
And obviously like air domain awareness is, you know, one of these overlapping terms that is used
[1:21:39 - 1:21:45] ▶
to put both traditional UFO, sorry, a certain sort of UASM identified, sorry, unmanned aerial systems
[1:21:45 - 1:21:53] ▶
as well as UAP together, right? And I think those are very important subjects, but sometimes they
[1:21:53 - 1:21:58] ▶
get conflated. But the good thing is we have like the technical capabilities in the skills to use
[1:21:58 - 1:22:05] ▶
in many different contexts. But right now like our focus, our mission is to collect the data on UAP,
[1:22:05 - 1:22:12] ▶
right? If that were, if there was another, you know, incident that required these capabilities,
[1:22:12 - 1:22:17] ▶
like we could deploy them, but I think it would be, it would probably at this point kind of a,
[1:22:17 - 1:22:21] ▶
at the cost of the research objectives we have. Well, gentlemen, Jake Barber and Matthew Pines,
[1:22:21 - 1:22:28] ▶
I take my hat off to you. If you really do have vision video of these objects across nine
[1:22:28 - 1:22:34] ▶
categories of object, including the jellyfish, I for one will be stuck to my TV screen waiting
[1:22:34 - 1:22:42] ▶
for that moment to see what you've been able to record. And I think everybody would wish you the
[1:22:42 - 1:22:46] ▶
very best in good intentions in achieving what you're setting up to achieve. What you're potentially
[1:22:46 - 1:22:53] ▶
setting up to achieve is historic. And thank you to both of you for appearing on Reality Check.
[1:22:53 - 1:22:59] ▶
You're welcome. Thank you, Ross. Yes, thanks, Rox. And please engage everyone that follows our work
[1:23:00 - 1:23:06] ▶
looking forward to hearing everyone's feedback. Actually, that's one thing I was going to ask you
[1:23:06 - 1:23:10] ▶
about. You actually say in the document that you're wanting people with either expertise and
[1:23:10 - 1:23:15] ▶
sciabilities or knowledge of systems or techniques that might be pertinent to your investigations,
[1:23:15 - 1:23:22] ▶
you're inviting people to come forward, aren't you? Yes, I think we'll have more structured
[1:23:22 - 1:23:27] ▶
sort of calls for expertise and involvement coming out in the future. But certainly if folks
[1:23:28 - 1:23:35] ▶
want to reply to our various socials, and then we'll be doing more kind of structured rollout
[1:23:35 - 1:23:40] ▶
of our website and other things. So there'll be more ways to sort of get engaged and contact
[1:23:41 - 1:23:47] ▶
a sky watcher in the near future, as well as we are looking for engagement on third-party review
[1:23:47 - 1:23:54] ▶
of our analysis. That will come when that analysis is ready.
[1:23:54 - 1:23:58] ▶
I would just say we have no shortage there right now. We're very fortunate to have the quality
[1:23:59 - 1:24:06] ▶
and quantity of individuals and professionals working. I mean, today we're out there on the range
[1:24:06 - 1:24:11] ▶
right now. And it's great. But we want, especially for that independent review, we want to expose
[1:24:11 - 1:24:16] ▶
this to more and more people. But right now, like just putting everyone on task, everyone's very
[1:24:16 - 1:24:23] ▶
enthusiastic. They all want to get involved. And we have a number of folks right now that are out
[1:24:23 - 1:24:29] ▶
there in the field. We're just looking to broaden that and expose that to more people for that third
[1:24:29 - 1:24:35] ▶
party verification and involvement. Well, I hope that wasn't a gunshot in the back of it.
[1:24:35 - 1:24:41] ▶
I'll call Ranger and they'll say you missed me.
[1:24:43 - 1:24:46] ▶
Gentlemen, thank you so much again. And I wish you the very, very best of luck in looking
[1:24:49 - 1:24:54] ▶
forward to your next video. Thanks for us. Next time.
[1:24:54 - 1:24:58] ▶
So we're also going to start doing questions and answers. So if you'd like to send your questions,
[1:24:59 - 1:25:07] ▶
please to reality check at newsnationnow.com. See you then.
[1:25:07 - 1:25:14] ▶
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