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Massive amounts of it.
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Over 90% of any rocket's mass at launch is just propellant.
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witnessed Brown's gravitator experiments in Los Angeles in 1952.
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Nothing too unusual about that.
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So when you drink this, it supports deep focus, long conversations, and sustained mental performance.
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It was originally developed through a multi-million dollar military program designed for high-stress environments
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delivered straight to my door like it teleported through one of Eric Davis' wormholes,
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and it still tastes better than just about anything your cousin microwaves.
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No fish farm sludge.
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Coho salmon, Pacific halibut, and my favorite, the sockeye salmon.
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Not all fish are the same.
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Get seafood you can trust.
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Go to wildalaskan.com slash jesse for $35 off your first box of premium wild caught seafood.
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That's wildalaskan.com slash jesse for $35 off your first order.
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Thank you so much to Wild Alaskan Company for sponsoring this episode.
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I'm here with Charles Buehler, who this is a holy grail interview for me.
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I'm like a kid on Christmas because it's been like the search for Buehler.
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Ever since, you know, we connected a couple years ago because I made this Townsend Brown documentary.
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And as you know and my audience knows, I am obsessed with this mid-century inventor, Thomas Townsend Brown.
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What's your current job title?
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So again, if this sort of force were attributable to basic electrostatics, you would know.
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And a lot of the tests that we do that we've been doing date to the 1960s, long before they had standardized testing from electrostatics.
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So we can embed that into glass.
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We can embed that into thermal radiators, solar panels, solar rays, all kinds of materials.
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to note is you've contributed to the field of electrostatics outside of this anomalous
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force that you're talking about.
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And you were the first person that showed that.
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It has to do with dynamics.
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And that didn't end when I went to graduate school and after I graduated.
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So, you know, my PhD is in theoretical condensed matter physics.
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So this goes way back into high school.
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And if you could, it would take you 80,000 years with current, current speeds.
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And that's, like, the closest habitable planet.
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I don't know if you know this.
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But the starship burns nine-tenths of its fuel tank.
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So, you know, not pouring cold water on that engineering effort.
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But, again, I do think from a physics perspective, from a pure design perspective, if there is this other force, we should obviously be looking into.
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And he did the test, and we saw the laser move.
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He wanted to see if we can do it independently.
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But, um, so we worked together because Andrew needed an electrostatics guy.
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Andrew knew he was getting into the realm of electrostatics.
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So at the time I was working with the, the field momentum converting into linear momentum
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Then I cranked up my power supply and that thing moved three, four feet in the air.
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So it's a very exciting place to be right now.
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And one of the things that's different about the force that we're talking about in the ion wind force, at least in terms of geometry, is that the devices will move with the wind.
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So you can, you know, you can apply high voltage to something.
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And it's, but it really flies in the face of the debunkers saying that it's attributable to ion wind because in an environment where there is less ion wind, you are getting more thrust.
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Hit me up at usa.alchemy at gmail.com.
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Skeptics are extremely welcome.
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Well, since Drew and I, we've been keeping track, we are close to 2,000.
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We haven't seen any that have said it negative, but we haven't seen,
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it hasn't been exposed to the entire scientific community either.
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and try to get it kind of academically checked off?
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Because people have done this.
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So you'll do this like you have like these DIY videos where it's like, go do this at home.
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I think it was 11 or 12.
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Just hanging over the trees.
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Just going over the road.
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Just not, you know, not moving very fast.
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Hanging out in formation.
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And all these cars were following these lights for several days.
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This happened over the course of several days.
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Was this like a famous UFO wave or flap or something?
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It was in the papers and all that jazz.
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Southeast New York in the mid-80s.
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It was a lot of fun.
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You know, I thought that was pretty cool.
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So I kind of like geared my career towards trying to understand some of that stuff.
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I just wanted to know what the heck that was.
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And it got me interested in physics, I think, and science in general.
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I was always interested in science.
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Did they look like orbs?
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Or were they part of a formation?
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Or do you think they were part of the same craft?
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I think they were different craft.
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I think they were just separate crafts.
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I didn't see a solid object or anything.
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And so this was for days at a time.
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Well, they would come every night.
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They'd come back and they'd be different parts of the city.
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I don't know what the heck they were doing or why they were there.
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Newspapers and television almost weekly carried reports of the sightings.
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And this was, it was a pretty cool event now that it's over.
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And maybe 12 years ago.
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We're like, man, that's getting kind of bright.
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Helicopter hangs over.
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Under the water, come back out.
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Like, this is really weird.
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It was mirroring.
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It was mirroring us.
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Did you get any sort of consciousness download or feel mentally locked in with it or anything like that?
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Did you know that Thomas Townsend Brown had a very similar experience?
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And the other high agency people who do other variations of what you're doing will come
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So this is the weird thing about these sorts of experiments.
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Does that make sense in the context of your experiment?
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Kind of high climb rates.
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Like the electrogravitics.
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But I don't know.
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Nick Cook is a hardheaded aviation journalist at Gene's Defense Weekly in the UK.
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to deal with it that it's like futile to even deal with physicists.
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Um, it's interesting stuff.
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So they're not real particles.
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And the other thing, there were 12 terms now instead of four.
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So I have 12 terms now.
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And that's all it is.
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It doesn't have the polarization that a real photon has.
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So, that seems to be an issue.
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And at first, it becomes virtual, meaning it can have complex momentum that's off-shell, but there's also momentum conservation, as you were saying.
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That's a kind of way to colloquially think of it.
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And so, you could have a one-loop diagram.
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A lot of infinities here.
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And that is a nasty integral that I have not been able to solve.
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I'm only looking at the cartoon picture, trying to interpret it. But if you want to help me with
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that, it'd be awesome. You want to have the real math? I had five or six kids started to work on that.
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And gamma functions, error functions, these are not fun things.
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Yeah, the integrals are definitely hard.
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They are not hard.
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It's not a beautiful solution like Coulomb's law. Whoop! It's different.
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Does the fact that Charles is talking about a time-independent perturbation, which you
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kind of hadn't anticipated before the conversation, does that change anything as far as the
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viability in your mind with QED? Or is that something you have to kind of think about offline?
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Well, you could do perturbations with frequency at the classical level. So,
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if you're claiming it's a quantum effect at some point, I think, I believe, I mean,
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with the five diagrams that you have, would there be any loops in the diagrams that you've been studying?
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Yeah, there's self-energy.
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Self-energy terms. There's 12 terms. And I think half of them are not very useful. But maybe the other half are.
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it went one way, like you would expect if it was a corona wind and then you pump it down, goes the other
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way. That would be, that's cool to see. Yeah. So, but you don't, like you say, you don't want the
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showing up experimentally. There's not too many experiments you could do in your garage to get
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you an alpha. And that points towards quantum electrodynamics. It points to quantum. Quantum in
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